• For users coming over from tmlfans.ca your username will remain the same but you will need to use the password reset feature (check your spam folder) on the login page in order to set your password. If you encounter issues, email Rick couchmanrick@gmail.com

Decisions, decisions

slapshot

New member
For the first time in a long while, the Leafs have established a pretty deep pool of NHL calibre or NHL ready players, which creates a healthy competition for spots but also creates a significant evaluation process to figure who to keep and who to discard, or who can be discarded? This "deep depth" scenario will be very interesting to see how it plays out. The Leafs seems to be overloaded in forwards, a little less deep on the back-end and even thinner in nets. Here's a brief look at the depth chart for discussion purposes. It assumes, Boyes, Grabner and Parenteau are left to free agency, though I liked how Parenteau performed. Not only the goals; he was actually one guy that would get into a scrum to stick up for teammates even though he isn't very big.

Center
The wild card here of course is Austen Matthews?

Let's make it interesting and assume the Leafs get him. That would leaving centre looking something like this to...

Matthews
Kadri
Nylander
Bozak
Froese
Gauthier

What would likely happen? Either Nylander or Matthews could end up moving to the wing because I don't think Kadri is getting dealt, and they both either are top 6 or soon would be. The only way all three could remain at centre in 2016-17 is if Bozak got dealt. Froese and Gauthier battle for the number 4 spot. If the Leafs don't get Matthews, Bozak could start as number 2 center, but probably by mid-year slips to number 3 and could be dealt at trade deadline.

Left wing
Let's work on the premise, the Leafs get 2nd pick and end up with Laine. Depth chart probably looks like this...

JVR
Laine
Komorov
Greening, Holland, Laich (tough choices for 4th spot)

Then pushing those guys are Leipsic, Timoshov, Johnson and Dzierkels, decent prospects who could surprise. Leipsic probably has the inside track, with the others getting seasoning in the Marlies. But even with that, there's 4 guys fighting for the fourth line, unless some get moved or the Leafs don't end up with Laine. Or maybe they end up 4th and pick Tkachuk, another left winger.

Right wing
Let's pretend the Leafs pick 3rd and get Puljijarvi. Another case of overcrowding. Depth chart could look something like this.

Lupul (I am being generous, started this year on 3rd line)
Soshnokov
Marner
Puljijarvi
Hyman
Brown
Michalek
Leivo
Kapanen
Bracco

That's probably at least 8 NHL ready right wingers, assuming Kapanen needs more seasoning and Bracco just isn't ready. Lupul and Michalek obviously need to be moved. That would leave six. Let's take Puljijarvi out for a moment, that still leaves Soshnokov, Marner, Brown, Hyman and Leivo to battle it out for 4 spots.

Defence

Rielly
Gardiner
Hunwick
Marincin
Carrick
Corrado

Seem to be the top 6 at the moment. But pushing underneath are Valiev, Loov, then maybe, Percy and Harrington. Interesting up and comers are Travis Dermott and Andrew Nielson, who both had great camps and pre-seasons last year, and Babcock was really high on both of them. They followed that up with really strong junior seasons. Both are probably Marlies next year, but who knows. Apart from Rielly and Gardiner, who seem to both be bonafide top 4 D-men, Rielly first pairing, Gardiner second pairing, the Leafs could benefit from some enhancement in the top 4 D for next year. Too bad this wasn't a year when a D-man was in the top 3-4 class.

Goal

Depth
Bernier
Sparks
Bibeau
Not much else

Clearly the weakest area. Nice to see Bernier finish strong, but there was no pressure, playoff wise, or serious competition from another tender...ie. Reimer. I think the Leafs will make a move for another veteran goalie to create some competition again. I also think they might draft a top-rated goalie in the second round. I am hoping they go for Dylan Wells of Peterborough. I truly hope Bernier has overcome his challenges. He was highly rated and highly regarded. I think spending his first few years as a young goalie behind Jonathan Quick hurt his development. Now let me make this clear - I am NOT comparing him to Carey Price directly. I just want to point this out. Price was top goalie pick in the 1st round pick in 2005, 5th overall. In his first three season with the Habs he got in 134 games. It took Bernier 6 seasons after his draft (5 with the Kings, and his first in TO) to get in 126 games.  Bernier was drafted a year after Price, also top netminder picked in 1st round, 11th overall. Even after his first three seasons with the Habs, there were those that questioned Price because his lack of playoff success. It wasn't until Price's 6th full season with the Habs, and more than 300 NHL games under his belt, that Price actually had a decent winning playoff season in 2014. Bernier so far has just 213 NHL games under his belt, 2/3 of what Price had when he turned things around for the better. I am hoping that Bernier can do the same. I DON'T MEAN - be the next Carey Price, I mean to mature as a solid #1 goalie. I think it takes time, and maybe with what he's gone through this year, maybe he's ready? That would be so perfect.

On top of all this depth, the Leafs have in this year's draft. two: first, second, third and fourth rounders, so plenty more coming down the pike. The point of the thread was just to demonstrate there are a lot of assets in the pipeline, so maybe packaging some this quantity for quality in two for one, or three for two trades, might be a way of increasing the quality.

It will at least be fun to see how all this plays out? And, we haven't even considered free agents...Stamkos or 2018 Tavares...probably the better option...
 
Great post. You've obviously put a lot of thought into the scenarios. I'm just about to go to bed but just immediately I'd say I don't see Bernier being the solution in goal. This was the year he really could have stepped up but he only played well after it didn't matter.

Also, Chychrun is thought by some to be a top four pick at d. We very well might end up with him if we pick fourth.
 
Good post, slapshot.

Just want to say about the free agents mentioned -- Stamkos, Tavares -- Tavares being "probably the better option".  I think I agree there.
What with Stamkos current health issue and Tavares being injury-free & in better health, naturally one wiuid go with Tavares if this were to happen now.

If Stamkos proves himself well (health-wise) for the upcoming season and Tavares stays relatively steady in that field too, it will have to come down to which player at what cost will provide value for the Leafs.

On account of the fact that I'm an Islander & Tavares fan, call it bias, call it what you will, I'd choose Johnny T if I had the choice.
 
Good post.

As it stands they are almost certainly going to be losing some young guys via waivers next year. I hope they can flip some quantity for quality before then. I know the management are smart enough to see this coming, so it'll be interesting to see who gets the chop and who makes the grade.
 
Another decision has to be on what free agents or even potential trade targets we go after. On the free agent front Stamkos and Tavares are already being mentioned over the next couple of years.

I'm seeing some (bizarre) rumours that PK Subban may be available for trade. I guess 2 questions, Is he someone we would want to trade for (allowing for his contract etc etc) and if so, would we have what is required in our prospects to bring him over via trade?

 
In terms of goalie depth , they signed that Finnish goalie Kaskisuo, not sure what they expect of him, or if he's even a viable prospect.
 
bustaheims said:
CarltonTheBear said:
Zee said:
Heroic Shrimp said:
Don't forget about Nikita Zaitsev! ;)

And Jimmy Vesey, if rumors are to be believed.

Most recent rumour has him going to Boston.

THey also have his dad advising him not to . . . but, not specifically advising him to sign anywhere else.

It's time for Lou to invite him and his dad over for some provolone, sausages and grappa and see where it ends up.
 
Zaitsev & Vesey -- Radulov!!

If we hit the rumor jackpot on all 3 of those AND get Matthews, the forward lineup would make my head spin.
 
Zee said:
bustaheims said:
CarltonTheBear said:
Zee said:
Heroic Shrimp said:
Don't forget about Nikita Zaitsev! ;)

And Jimmy Vesey, if rumors are to be believed.

Most recent rumour has him going to Boston.

THey also have his dad advising him not to . . . but, not specifically advising him to sign anywhere else.

It's time for Lou to invite him and his dad over for some provolone, sausages and grappa and see where it ends up.

I think a visit from Lou and his henchmen at about 3:00 am might be more effective.
 
I have trouble seeing the lineup right now; should be much clearer by July, after the draft and free agency opens up trade conversations.

The draft will be big, but only the first overall pick will affect our NHL lineup directly. I can see them sending Laine/Puljujarvi to the Marlies. If we get the 4th overall, he will stay in juniors almost regardless of how he plays just because of the direction management wants the Leafs to go (more pain).

The big difference this upcoming season, as slapshot alludes to, is the ridiculous amount of competition there will be heading into training camp. This past year, the lineup was pretty much set with the UFAs clogging the pipelines deliberately. This coming season has some pending UFA vets clogging the pipeline, but much more softly because of all the waiver eligible AHL vets that might come up. It's a good problem to have.

I can see them swinging more Grabner trades, likely moving out Burke/Nonis waiver-eligible prospects that aren't quite up to snuff, or packaging them to gain draft pick quality, as well as spinning off some prime players (Bozak, Kadri, JvR, Komarov) for high potential prospects closer to the bottom of their development curves. That should start freeing up space on the Leafs for players management are higher on to demonstrate their development. Vets like Laich, Michalek, Greening, Hunwick, Bernier will probably stay until the deadline to shepherd the newer players and then recoup picks where possible.

There's almost no point in dipping into free agency unless there are obvious holes that have no internal competition (goaltending?). We're not in the right position to throw money at established players just yet.
 
I know that I am going against most fans here when I want to keep any player under 22 years old out of the line up until the UFAs are traded at the deadline like this season.  I feel one more year of transition would be stellar strategy for getting a good position in the draft in 2017 as well as accumulate more draft picks for veterans.

Off season trades:
1) I am hoping Lou will send Cowen and a prospect like Corrado to Chicago for Bickell, a 2016 4th pick and a wild card CHI prospect like 5th rounder LW 6'5" Bondra who might balance all the small RH Leaf prospects.
2) Trouba - trade what is needed to get this 22 year old RH defender.  The Leafs have the forward depth at RW and that is a place WPG is thin in prospects.  With the Leafs having RH prospects including Nylander, Marner, Brown, Kapanen, Hyman, Leivo and quite possibly Laine or Puljujarvi to play top 6 minutes so someone can be moved.
3) Some players haven't hit the next level including Holland and possibly Leivo.

2017 Trade Deadline Trade Bait:
Michalek, Laich, Greening, Hunwick...
...and maybe Bickell if we move Cowen for him.  I know Lou said that the Leafs were going to buy him out but the Leafs don't need the cap space and Chicago is desperate for it.

After April 30th it will be a lot easier for us fans to fantasize. 
https://www.reddit.com/r/leafs/comments/4eg315/oc_laine_vs_puljuj%C3%A4rvi_an_in_depth_breakdown/
 
Regarding potential prospects coming:
1)It looks like Nikita Zaitsev is signing with the Leafs as a solid RH dman. 
2)Hopefully the Leafs are in the running for Vesey as a 'JVR' type 6'3" LH LW.

As for signing Alexander Radulov, it makes no sense to me at all to commit years right now to a 1986 born player.  I read people here debate the sanity of signing Stamkos because of his age and he is 4 years younger.

Current Leaf UFAs
I don't see any need to re-sign the Leafs UFAs unless it is to provide leadership on the Marlies (Brennan, Clune, etc).



So here is what I see as options:

LW
'89 JVR LH
'93 J Vesey
'98 Laine RH
'87 Komorov LH
'86 Greening LH T-TD17
'83 Laich LH T-TD17
'91 Holland LH T-S16
 
CENTER
'90 Kadri LH
'96 Nylander RH
'86 Bozak RH
'91 Froese RH
'95 Gauthier LH
 
RW
'93 Soshnokov LH
'97 Marner RH
'98 Puljijarvi RH
'92 Hyman RH
'94 Brown RH
'84 Michalek LH T-TD17
'93 Leivo RH T-S16
'96 Kapanen RH T-S16

LD
'94 Rielly LH
'90 Gardiner LH
'92 Marincin LH
'85 Hunwick LH T-TD17
'91 Cowen LH T-S16
 
RD
'94 Carrick RH
'93 Corrado RH T-S16
'91 Zaitsev RH

Acquire:
'86 Bickell LH forward
'94 Trouba RH dman

With Laine and Puljijarvi both playing in Europe this year, both can do the Nylander and play for the Marlies next season until the trade deadline.  Marner unfortunately doesn't qualify.  Aparently too good for the OHL but still not ready for the NHL....I have no idea. 

If the trades for summer 2016 happen I would suggest October's line up look something like:
LW
'89 JVR LH
'93 J Vesey
'87 Komorov LH
'86 Greening LH T-TD17
'86 Bickell LH T-TD17
 
CENTER
'90 Kadri LH
'86 Bozak RH
'83 Laich LH T-TD17
'91 Froese RH
 
RW
'93 Soshnokov LH
'92 Hyman RH
'94 Brown RH
'84 Michalek LH T-TD17

LD
'94 Rielly LH
'90 Gardiner LH
'92 Marincin LH
'85 Hunwick LH T-TD17
 
RD
'94 Trouba RH
'94 Carrick RH
'91 Zaitsev RH

LITR
'83 Lupul
'85 Horton
'77 Robidas
https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/eh-game/maple-leafs-notes--robidas-set-to-retire--lupul-recovering-from-surgery-232228708.html

Marlies
'98 Puljijarvi RH or '98 Laine RH
'96 Nylander RH
'95 Gauthier LH

??
'97 Marner RH

After the 2017 trade deadline I feel the line up look something like:
LW
'89 JVR LH
'98 Puljijarvi or Laine RH
'93 J Vesey LH
'87 Komorov LH

 
CENTER
'90 Kadri LH
'86 Bozak RH
'96 Nylander RH
'91 Froese RH
 
RW
'97 Marner RH
'93 Soshnokov LH
'92 Hyman RH
'94 Brown RH


LD
'94 Rielly LH
'90 Gardiner LH
'92 Marincin LH

 
RD
'94 Trouba RH
'94 Carrick RH
'91 Zaitsev RH
 
Britishbulldog said:
I know that I am going against most fans here when I want to keep any player under 22 years old out of the line up until the UFAs are traded at the deadline like this season.  I feel one more year of transition would be stellar strategy for getting a good position in the draft in 2017 as well as accumulate more draft picks for veterans.

Off season trades:
1) I am hoping Lou will send Cowen and a prospect like Corrado to Chicago for Bickell, a 2016 4th pick and a wild card CHI prospect like 5th rounder LW 6'5" Bondra who might balance all the small RH Leaf prospects.
2) Trouba - trade what is needed to get this 22 year old RH defender.  The Leafs have the forward depth at RW and that is a place WPG is thin in prospects.  With the Leafs having RH prospects including Nylander, Marner, Brown, Kapanen, Hyman, Leivo and quite possibly Laine or Puljujarvi to play top 6 minutes so someone can be moved.
3) Some players haven't hit the next level including Holland and possibly Leivo.

2017 Trade Deadline Trade Bait:
Michalek, Laich, Greening, Hunwick...
...and maybe Bickell if we move Cowen for him.  I know Lou said that the Leafs were going to buy him out but the Leafs don't need the cap space and Chicago is desperate for it.

After April 30th it will be a lot easier for us fans to fantasize. 
https://www.reddit.com/r/leafs/comments/4eg315/oc_laine_vs_puljuj%C3%A4rvi_an_in_depth_breakdown/
 
Regarding potential prospects coming:
1)It looks like Nikita Zaitsev is signing with the Leafs as a solid RH dman. 
2)Hopefully the Leafs are in the running for Vesey as a 'JVR' type 6'3" LH LW.

As for signing Alexander Radulov, it makes no sense to me at all to commit years right now to a 1986 born player.  I read people here debate the sanity of signing Stamkos because of his age and he is 4 years younger.

Current Leaf UFAs
I don't see any need to re-sign the Leafs UFAs unless it is to provide leadership on the Marlies (Brennan, Clune, etc).



So here is what I see as options:

LW
'89 JVR LH
'93 J Vesey
'98 Laine RH
'87 Komorov LH
'86 Greening LH T-TD17
'83 Laich LH T-TD17
'91 Holland LH T-S16
 
CENTER
'90 Kadri LH
'96 Nylander RH
'86 Bozak RH
'91 Froese RH
'95 Gauthier LH
 
RW
'93 Soshnokov LH
'97 Marner RH
'98 Puljijarvi RH
'92 Hyman RH
'94 Brown RH
'84 Michalek LH T-TD17
'93 Leivo RH T-S16
'96 Kapanen RH T-S16

LD
'94 Rielly LH
'90 Gardiner LH
'92 Marincin LH
'85 Hunwick LH T-TD17
'91 Cowen LH T-S16
 
RD
'94 Carrick RH
'93 Corrado RH T-S16
'91 Zaitsev RH

Acquire:
'86 Bickell LH forward
'94 Trouba RH dman

With Laine and Puljijarvi both playing in Europe this year, both can do the Nylander and play for the Marlies next season until the trade deadline.  Marner unfortunately doesn't qualify.  Aparently too good for the OHL but still not ready for the NHL....I have no idea. 

If the trades for summer 2016 happen I would suggest October's line up look something like:
LW
'89 JVR LH
'93 J Vesey
'87 Komorov LH
'86 Greening LH T-TD17
'86 Bickell LH T-TD17
 
CENTER
'90 Kadri LH
'86 Bozak RH
'83 Laich LH T-TD17
'91 Froese RH
 
RW
'93 Soshnokov LH
'92 Hyman RH
'94 Brown RH
'84 Michalek LH T-TD17

LD
'94 Rielly LH
'90 Gardiner LH
'92 Marincin LH
'85 Hunwick LH T-TD17
 
RD
'94 Trouba RH
'94 Carrick RH
'91 Zaitsev RH

LITR
'83 Lupul
'85 Horton
'77 Robidas
https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/eh-game/maple-leafs-notes--robidas-set-to-retire--lupul-recovering-from-surgery-232228708.html

Marlies
'98 Puljijarvi RH or '98 Laine RH
'96 Nylander RH
'95 Gauthier LH

??
'97 Marner RH

After the 2017 trade deadline I feel the line up look something like:
LW
'89 JVR LH
'98 Puljijarvi or Laine RH
'93 J Vesey LH
'87 Komorov LH

 
CENTER
'90 Kadri LH
'86 Bozak RH
'96 Nylander RH
'91 Froese RH
 
RW
'97 Marner RH
'93 Soshnokov LH
'92 Hyman RH
'94 Brown RH


LD
'94 Rielly LH
'90 Gardiner LH
'92 Marincin LH

 
RD
'94 Trouba RH
'94 Carrick RH
'91 Zaitsev RH

Although I hate all the losing, another year of basement dwelling will do wonders for accumulating more prospect depth at the 2017 draft.
 
Al14 said:
Britishbulldog said:
I know that I am going against most fans here when I want to keep any player under 22 years old out of the line up until the UFAs are traded at the deadline like this season.  I feel one more year of transition would be stellar strategy for getting a good position in the draft in 2017 as well as accumulate more draft picks for veterans.

Although I hate all the losing, another year of basement dwelling will do wonders for accumulating more prospect depth at the 2017 draft.

My concern with the excitement of the prospects that some might expect the Leafs have a Doughty, Quick, Kopitar or a Toews, Kane, Keith, Seabrook, Crawford in the Leafs lineup already and that the Leafs are finished the 'pain'.  I see the Leafs with some solid pieces but not that level yet to compete for the Cup. 

This draft should help and if the Leafs get a top 10 pick next year combined with the other 7 picks currently owned PLUS any picks received for Michalek, Laich, Greening, Hunwick...
...and maybe Bickell if the Leafs move Cowen for him.  That means the Leafs could add 5 or more picks for the 2017 draft to the 8 already owned.
 
Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate said:
Zaitsev & Vesey -- Radulov!!

If we hit the rumor jackpot on all 3 of those AND get Matthews, the forward lineup would make my head spin.

Radulov????

Are you smoking something illegal? Then again the professionalism he has displayed his whole career would fit in nicely.
 

About Us

This website is NOT associated with the Toronto Maple Leafs or the NHL.


It is operated by Rick Couchman and Jeff Lewis.
Back
Top