• For users coming over from tmlfans.ca your username will remain the same but you will need to use the password reset feature (check your spam folder) on the login page in order to set your password. If you encounter issues, email Rick couchmanrick@gmail.com

Is it panic time yet?

Zee

Zee

Active member
A month ago I wouldn't have believed the Leafs could possibly miss the playoffs this season. We have John Tavares!  We have Auston Matthews, we have Mitch Marner!

Well, here we are, a Habs win tonight and Leafs are in a wildcard spot.  I understand Leafs have 3 games in hand over the Habs after tonight, but the recent stretch of play doesn't fill me with confidence that they'll win those games in hand.

I understand the Leafs are generally a young team, and there's still growing pains to an extent, but this team is REALLY under performing right now.  If, and I say IF the Leafs were to miss the playoffs this season, does the axe fall on Babcock?  Dubas has only been on the job less than a season, so it's not as if he's made wholesale changes to the roster (other than adding one of the top centermen in the league), so the blame doesn't fall on him.  Is Babcock doing enough to get these guys ready to play?  Are his systems up to date an in tune with the skills he has on the roster?

Will this thread look ridiculous in a month's time if the Leafs go on a run and re-establish 2nd in the conference by a fair margin?  All good questions.
 
I don't think they're in much danger of missing the playoffs but even if they do Babcock won't be fired. It would be
Legitimate to talk about firing him but it won't happen.

They need to put on their big boy pants and start playing with some purpose. And make an upgrade on d.
 
I have been wondering about Babcock's coaching for awhile now. While I assume he is a smarter hockey guy than me it always seems he is trying too hard to be the smartest guy in the room rather than just doing the obvious for best results. And it does appear he doesn't do so well over the long term with players tuning out his always on personality. I think he was what we needed when we got him but I see little to suggest he is getting the most out of this roster. 
 
Zee said:
Will this thread look ridiculous in a month's time if the Leafs go on a run and re-establish 2nd in the conference by a fair margin?  All good questions.
Click to expand...

It looks kind of ridiculous now.
 
Bullfrog said:
Zee said:
Will this thread look ridiculous in a month's time if the Leafs go on a run and re-establish 2nd in the conference by a fair margin?  All good questions.
Click to expand...

It looks kind of ridiculous now.
Click to expand...
Really? From 20-8 record to 29-16-2? This isn't just a small slump
 
Zee said:
Really? From 20-8 record to 29-16-2? This isn't just a small slump
Click to expand...

Their record went from 20-8 to 6-2-2 to 3-6. It's literally just a small slump. On that coincided with their starting goalie being out and having to use their 3rd stringer for awhile.
 
Zee said:
Really? From 20-8 record to 29-16-2? This isn't just a small slump
Click to expand...

It?s also not the long a slump. They were 25-10-2 heading in the Christmas break, and then their starting goalie got hurt. Of course they were going to struggle for a while. They still haven?t lost more than two in a row in any stretch. They?re really just going through some mid-season blahs while the teams behind them have gotten hot. That?ll shift the other way soon enough (though, maybe not soon enough for some of the pessimists around here). It?s January. There?s still almost half a season left to play. The team has a long break coming up to get their collective heads back in the right place. It?s way too early for this level of handwringing.
 
I think that the complaints about Babcock and the lower lineup are the easy way out. He hasn't forgotten how to coach over the last 8 games, and he's done an amazing job with a very young team over the last few years.

The issue is with the top end players. We were supposed to have two top lines that the opponents couldn't line match against, which along with good goaltending, paper over our suspect defence weak side pairings. Matthews and Nylander have been terrible, and that overrides any concerns I have about Babcock or Zaitsev, or Hainsey, or those type of whipping boys. I don't care what the advanced stats say. If those two are going to account for $19M+ of our cap next year, they can't take stretches of games off.


The other problem is Dubas'.

The overall team mix is extremely soft, particularly the defence, which is fine if they can skate well and transition effectively - but they can't and don't, and rely on elite goaltending way too much.
I've been an advocate of getting a player like Gudas for likely a palatable return at the deadline; but I'm thinking it might be wise to overpay slightly to make that trade a bit sooner than later. A bigger move as well for a top 3 defenceman has to be made at some point as well, easier said than done, but if they want to get out of the first round, they need some size and strength added.

 
I think it's fair to say a lot of us here have a reasonable handle on what a bad team looks like. This ain't it.

There's an air of a mob mentality happening in the fanbase where media-driven narrative seeps into their viewing lens. TSN/SportsNet and the like have a deliberately myopic focus to capitalize on fan-emotions and people just get swept right up into it. GDTs are now overrun with people who pretty much only post when the Leafs have something bad happen to them. That's just what happens when expectations are high because people only make note when their expectations are not met.

The first 5 games of blistering offense was not a true picture of this team, just as these past few games weren't a true picture of the team's capabilities. There were many underlying problems to the Leafs game at the beginning of the season that were obfuscated by GOALS GALORE on the powerplay. Now the team is generally playing a crap ton better 5v5 but it's masked by not having our regular goaltending + a handful of shooting slumps (WHICH HAPPEN ALL THE TIME, now magnified with injury and a contract thing which hurt all your poor widdle feelings) coinciding.

Marner scored like 1 goal in 30+ games at the beginning of last season, but no one here was roasting him because everyone else was scoring. Kypreos wanted the Leafs to trade him! Do you truly think two straight seasons of 60 pts is Nylander's high water mark?

The surface of the ocean may be choppy with whatever the weather is doing, but look a little deeper and you'll get a better sense of what's actually happening.
 
I agree with Herman
Matthews despite his claims has not been as dominant as before his shoulder injury, Nylander just took to much time off but will round out in time, Marleau best before date expired some time ago.  We have a great team and with Freddie regaining form like against the Lightening, they will start to rack up the wins again.  Lets face it the team does play much better in front of him than the backups, not that last night is Sparks fault from what I could see.  We just have to take our chill pill and let it play out. 8)
 
herman said:
Marner scored like 1 goal in 30+ games at the beginning of last season, but no one here was roasting him because everyone else was scoring. Kypreos wanted the Leafs to trade him! Do you turly think two straight seasons of 60 pts is Nylander's high water mark?
Click to expand...

Marner had 19 points over those 30 games, playing at times with guys like Matt Martin if I recall. I think no one was roasting him because it was a pretty impressive performance to be making plugs like Martin actually put points up.

And yes, truth be told, I do think 60 points is about Nylander's high water mark. I still maintain a good portion of his stats are a product of Matthews, and he won't achieve that success driving a line himself. He's a good player, and probably will end up being worth his contract. But comparing him to Marner is a fool's errand, imo, and does him no favours.
 
I think it's more frustration than panic. No need for games like last night on far too many nights. Inexcusable.
Listening to Babcock's post games and some players interviews makes me wanna puke.
Team relies way too heavily on Freddy plain and simple and has been like that for 3 years.
What has really changed in the Leafs system over the last 3 years?
Team has looked fairly the same in the way it plays and yes everyones happy because the wins are there but again Freddy is the MVP of this team.
I don't expect players to excel every game but at least put in 100%.
Herman, Highlander all of you guys here I love posting on here and reading your views and respect them but this team needs some changes.
You can say it's just a blip but deep down this team could be better.
Is it Babcock? I personally think some of these guys don't want to play for him.
His handling of players doesn't make sense.
Personally I don't think Matthews cares for him and it's showing.

Babcock needs to give up the ego thing and start coaching this team to get the most out of his players.
Team has more talent than most and a lot of nights aint showing it.
How funny would it be if we miss the playoffs and the Habs don't?
That's a good possibility as much as some of you don't think it will happen.

Weaker teams with better coaching get more out of their players than Babcock.
Again comes down to the players to perform but coach has to get them prepared and playing to their capabilities.
Is it just a slump? Maybe but I don't think so. Some changes need to be made.
Some help on the D, some more grit and hold these guys accountable. If you ain't playing hard sit them.
I don't care who you are. 
 
azzurri63 said:
I think it's more frustration than panic. No need for games like last night on far too many nights. Inexcusable.
Listening to Babcock's post games and some players interviews makes me wanna puke.
Team relies way too heavily on Freddy plain and simple and has been like that for 3 years.
What has really changed in the Leafs system over the last 3 years?
Team has looked fairly the same in the way it plays and yes everyones happy because the wins are there but again Freddy is the MVP of this team.
I don't expect players to excel every game but at least put in 100%.
Herman, Highlander all of you guys here I love posting on here and reading your views and respect them but this team needs some changes.
You can say it's just a blip but deep down this team could be better.
Is it Babcock? I personally think some of these guys don't want to play for him.
His handling of players doesn't make sense.
Personally I don't think Matthews cares for him and it's showing.

Babcock needs to give up the ego thing and start coaching this team to get the most out of his players.
Team has more talent than most and a lot of nights aint showing it.
How funny would it be if we miss the playoffs and the Habs don't?
That's a good possibility as much as some of you don't think it will happen.

Weaker teams with better coaching get more out of their players than Babcock.
Again comes down to the players to perform but coach has to get them prepared and playing to their capabilities.
Is it just a slump? Maybe but I don't think so. Some changes need to be made.
Some help on the D, some more grit and hold these guys accountable. If you ain't playing hard sit them.
I don't care who you are.
Click to expand...
Your last points are exactly my issue. Look at the Islanders, nobody would say they have a more talented roster than the Leafs but Trotz has them playing a system well, and they're better than the sum of their parts. With the talent the Leafs have on the roster they should be closer to Tampa in the standings then the wild card spot. So why do they have so many embarrassing efforts like last night? What's the issue if not coaching?
 
So for all the guys in this thread who think everything is good, it's only a slump etc, at what point do you think something is wrong? If the Leafs miss the playoffs? If the Leafs scrape in and get bounced badly in the first round?
 
Who is it exactly that claims everything is good? Why is it either "open your head and feast on the goo" or "complete ignorant bliss" with you panickers? Most of us are being rational. Nylander's production is terrible (despite otherwise good play), Kadri's in a slump, our defence behind the three puck-movers (Rielly, Gardiner, Dermott) is below average, etc. I don't think anyone is claiming this is the best team in history.

I'll just speak for myself and say that it's definitely not a time for panic. They're in a tiny slump; it'll be balanced by a winning streak. Look at the criticism in the GDT's. Those of us "who think everything is good" are constantly suggesting Babcock mix up the lines. We're critical of crappy giveaways, lazy plays, and puzzling coaching decisions. We just balance our emotions by recognizing the good stuff. For example, as much as he's ripped on, Gardiner makes tonnes of great little plays that don't even get mentioned.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

About Us

This website is NOT associated with the Toronto Maple Leafs or the NHL.


It is operated by Rick Couchman and Jeff Lewis.
Back
Top