Leafs trade Colborne

[Jalili]

To me, this really stings because it means Toronto ends up getting basically nothing for Kaberle.  :'(

Boston wins again.......NOOOOOOOO!!!

Kaberle proved since that he was basically worth nothing and he is not even in the league anymore. Trade was a wash.

Hold on... Kaberle did lead their D in scoring in their playoff run, on the way to winning a Stanley Cup. They definitely won that trade. Not that it really matters, but still.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Yeah, Joe can thank Carter Ashton and Mason Raymond for his demise. Liles still has to go IMO. It actually pisses me off a bit that Nonis didn't buyout Liles when he had the chance.

 

[Redleaf]

Yeah, Joe can thank Carter Ashton and Mason Raymond for his demise. Liles still has to go IMO. It actually pisses me off a bit that Nonis didn't buyout Liles when he had the chance.

Agree with the Liles buyout option. It was a real head scratcher.

On a different topic... Now that they have a gluten of prospects at D, do they start drafting by position now? Starting with the Gauthier pick, selecting forwards may be the plan for the next few years.

 

[Stronger Than All]

Lievo have a chance now?  maybe just Ashton.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

On a different topic... Now that they have a gluten of prospects at D, do they start drafting by position now? Starting with the Gauthier pick, selecting forwards may be the plan for the next few years.

I still think you probably go with the best player available, unless the choices in that area are so close that it probably wouldn't matter.

 

[L K]

I was never a big fan of Colborne.  I always felt that he was a guy who was doing very little but was being given a bit of a pass because he's big and maybe became something.  That being said, that he gets dumped over Orr/McLaren is just silly. Colton Orr gets paid a million dollars to have 10-12 staged fights a year and do little else.  Excellent cap management.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Lievo have a chance now?  maybe just Ashton.

I think Ashton has it locked up.

 

[TML fan]

Yeah, Joe can thank Carter Ashton and Mason Raymond for his demise. Liles still has to go IMO. It actually pisses me off a bit that Nonis didn't buyout Liles when he had the chance.

Agree with the Liles buyout option. It was a real head scratcher.

On a different topic... Now that they have a gluten of prospects at D, do they start drafting by position now? Starting with the Gauthier pick, selecting forwards may be the plan for the next few years.

If they bought out Liles we'd still be stuck with Komisarek or Grabovski. Either way it's a bigger cap hit and the Leafs still have the same problem, plus the problem of what the heck to do with Grabovski

Any way you slice it, the Leafs have cap trouble and are stuck with one player who isn't really useful to the team anymore. Liles was actually the best option not to buy out because he has the least impact on the cap.

 

[pmrules]

I understand the hate for Orr and Mclaren and what they bring and whether they deserve a spot on the team.  I do.

But I don't think colborne lost his job because of Orr and McLaren.  Even with Orr/McLaren on the team, he still had a job pencilled in the bottom 6.  Raymond/Ashton/Leivo plain old beat him for it (from what i hear).

McLaren (injury)/Clarkson (suspension) and his own spot - 3 spots for him.  He lost it.

Don't blame Orr and McLaren (they are down the list on blame chart) - blame Colborne. 

 

[Big Daddy]

I think part of the problem has to be how stinking rich this kid is. Its very hard to get motivated for a season to be making 900,000 G when he has more money than that tied up in vehicles.  Unbelievably rich kids just dont have the desire.  And dont think Burkie's a fool. Find one of the richest families in Calgary and trade for his kid.  He did it in Toronto. I mean he gets a bigger allowance from his dad then he got payed by the leafs. I wish him well though. Burke will be in the room tying his skates no doubt.

 

[pmrules]

To me, this really stings because it means Toronto ends up getting basically nothing for Kaberle.  :'(

Boston wins again.......NOOOOOOOO!!!

Kaberle proved since that he was basically worth nothing and he is not even in the league anymore. Trade was a wash.

Hold on... Kaberle did lead their D in scoring in their playoff run, on the way to winning a Stanley Cup. They definitely won that trade. Not that it really matters, but still.

As soon as Boston won the cup we were likely losing this trade.  The best we could possibly do is call it a wash if Colborne became a stud 2nd/3rd liner for years.  Obviously not going to happen now (at least with us).

 

[mr grieves]

If they bought out Liles we'd still be stuck with Komisarek or Grabovski. Either way it's a bigger cap hit and the Leafs still have the same problem, plus the problem of what the heck to do with Grabovski

Any way you slice it, the Leafs have cap trouble and are stuck with one player who isn't really useful to the team anymore. Liles was actually the best option not to buy out because he has the least impact on the cap.

If you're going to bring this up again, I'll correct you again:

Hold Grabo (-5.5), let Bozak walk (+4.2), buyout Komi (+4.5), buyout Liles (+3.85) = 7.05 cap savings.
vs.
Sign Bozak (-4.2), hold Liles (-3.85), buyout Komi (+4.5), buyout Grabo (+5.5), demote Liles (+.925) = 2.875 cap savings.

So, it's an over $4m difference.

Also, holding and demoting Liles leaves the Leafs with nearly $3m more dead cap space.

 

[Deebo]

Or a regular course buyout for Komisarek and a compliance buyout for Liles could have worked.

Year 1 Komisarek 2.17 < Liles 3.875

Year 2 Komisarek 1.17 < Liles 3.875

Year 3 Komisrek 0 < Liles 3.875

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Or a regular course buyout for Komisarek and a compliance buyout for Liles could have worked.

Year 1 Komisarek 2.17 < Liles 3.875

Year 2 Komisarek 1.17 < Liles 3.875

Year 3 Komisrek 0 < Liles 3.875

Yeah, this is really a no-brainer.

 

[losveratos]

If they bought out Liles we'd still be stuck with Komisarek or Grabovski. Either way it's a bigger cap hit and the Leafs still have the same problem, plus the problem of what the heck to do with Grabovski

Any way you slice it, the Leafs have cap trouble and are stuck with one player who isn't really useful to the team anymore. Liles was actually the best option not to buy out because he has the least impact on the cap.

If you're going to bring this up again, I'll correct you again:

Hold Grabo (-5.5), let Bozak walk (+4.2), buyout Komi (+4.5), buyout Liles (+3.85) = 7.05 cap savings.
vs.
Sign Bozak (-4.2), hold Liles (-3.85), buyout Komi (+4.5), buyout Grabo (+5.5), demote Liles (+.925) = 2.875 cap savings.

So, it's an over $4m difference.

Also, holding and demoting Liles leaves the Leafs with nearly $3m more dead cap space.

Then I'll go back and revise history further in the past than you to prove my anti Grabs position instead of your pro Grabs position.

Don't ever sign Grabs to 5.5mil buy out Liles and Komi and sign Bozak to 4.2. Yay ==== 1.3mil in savings! Bozak's better! Woohoo!

If you cherry pick your starting position after the facts you can usually prove any position. Your chain of events is only better in hindsight and from your arbitrary starting point.

For all of our mental health... please just accept that your love spawn is gone from the team.

The staff gave up on him. End of story.

 

[princedpw]

The Leafs have room for both Orr and McLaren over Colborne? Honestly, I get that Joe hasn't exactly lit things up, but that just seems like an absolutely asinine decision.

If the choices are putting him on waivers or keeping him on the 4th line does it really matter?

Yes.  A repetitive series of sucky minor moves eventually add up. 

I just re-watched Colborne play a nice game last year against the Bruins in the playoffs.  His play was significantly better than anything one could ever dream of getting out of a guy like Orr.  And Colborne has lots of time to improve.  And Colborne has a smaller cap hit.  And injuries will likely strike during the season and we have a lack of NHL center-depth but plenty of wingers.

 

[Deebo]

One thing that will happen is the a amount that is knocked off Liles' cap hit when assigned to the minors will increase over the next 2 seasons as the NHL minimum salary increases.

 

[lamajama]

I understand the hate for Orr and Mclaren and what they bring and whether they deserve a spot on the team.  I do.

But I don't think colborne lost his job because of Orr and McLaren.  Even with Orr/McLaren on the team, he still had a job pencilled in the bottom 6.  Raymond/Ashton/Leivo plain old beat him for it (from what i hear).

McLaren (injury)/Clarkson (suspension) and his own spot - 3 spots for him.  He lost it.

Don't blame Orr and McLaren (they are down the list on blame chart) - blame Colborne.

X10. There was a spot but he got beat out by Ashton at least.  I watched every ex game and you seen Ashton's effort every game but IMO you had to really look for Colborne  Sad to see him go but I don't think he would have cleared waivers. Look at it that the Leafs finally have some depth.

As far as Orr et all go, the Leafs started this goon race and they can't dis-arm now with the rest of the division signing goons (except Detroit....)

 

[mr grieves]

If you cherry pick your starting position after the facts you can usually prove any position. Your chain of events is only better in hindsight and from your arbitrary starting point.

Cherry pick doesn't really mean what you think it does.

There's nothing arbitrary about choosing a starting position to discuss the off season that is the beginning of the off season.

There is no "after the facts" here, since a lot people were arguing the Leafs should do what I suggested above at that time. There are no "new facts" here that weren't predicted by a lot of people at that time.

 

[mr grieves]

The Leafs have room for both Orr and McLaren over Colborne? Honestly, I get that Joe hasn't exactly lit things up, but that just seems like an absolutely asinine decision.

If the choices are putting him on waivers or keeping him on the 4th line does it really matter?

Yes.  A repetitive series of sucky minor moves eventually add up. 

I just re-watched Colborne play a nice game last year against the Bruins in the playoffs.  His play was significantly better than anything one could ever dream of getting out of a guy like Orr.  And Colborne has lots of time to improve.  And Colborne has a smaller cap hit.  And injuries will likely strike during the season and we have a lack of NHL center-depth but plenty of wingers.

That's what I don't really understand. The guys who can't be trusted to play the games that count are held over the guy who could play in those games?

I'm all on board with pmrules's thing. Leivo, Ashton, Raymond took his spot, not Orr or McLaren. But I'd still rather have a bottom six wings populated with Leivo, Ashton, Raymond, Colborne and one of the enforcers. But, given the minutes we're talking about, it's hardly a strong preference.

It's also notable that Colborne can play center... Not very impressively, but the team seems thin at that position.