Shot Fired on Parliament Hill

[Highlander]

And by the way Islam is every bit as beautiful a religion as Zen or Christianity?but this is not Islam in the least.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Don't want to ruffle anyone up, just some questions? Why did we send 18 of our best warplanes and 600 soldiers to the mid-East for a year?  Is this a training exercise? What is it termed?  Have we declared war on ISIS?  If not what is this?

Regarding the combatants, we wear uniforms, we identify ourselves as combatants. ISIS hides behind masks.

If you read back to the Civil War days, the combatants in that war where overwhelming Volunteers (as the US only had a standing army of around 15K) meaning over 800,000 men in that conflict where normal citizens. Whatever their motives for joining the different sides whether race or religion or something else, the rules of engagment or war where the same as WW2, if you where caught behind enemy lines in non uniform you were executed with no trial.

So what is this thing we are in? That is all I am asking. And how many more islolated incidents of this kind of madness are we all prepared to put up with?  (even if today as not an extremist)

Thats my bolt and it is shot.  I will shut up now.

 

[Bender]

Yes but ISIS has declared itself a Caliphate and has claimed its aims are to harm the west.
A Caliphate is a state. These are the people that our home grown extremist are running to.

Which means that should our elected officials actually declare war on ISIS then people who are actually associated with them, officially, could in fact be treated as enemy agents or soldiers. But your average wackadoo couldn't just be assumed to be associated them by dint of a shared race, country of origin or religion.

edit: Although even with that said I think one of the prerequisites for an official declaration of war is that another nation is officially recognized to be a legitimate government which strikes me as unlikely for ISIS. Declaring yourself a caliphate is not quite the same thing as being one.

True, but I actually am the King of England.

 

[crazyperfectdevil]

it's gotten awfully talk radio around here

 

[Bender]

it's gotten awfully talk radio around here

Howard Stern is rolling in his grave.

 

[Highlander]

sorry but with no game it is a bit of a bore as I said I am done on this. and it doesnt look like it will be played tomorrow either.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Moved some things over here from the GDT. I would also ask that we take it down a level on the political talk. This isn't really the place for serious discussions on those topics.

 

[mc]

One of the shooters is identified as Michael Zehaf-Bibeau

 

[TML fan]

I was just having this argument with a colleague at work.

Him: This is terrorism'
Me: ok, what's they're goal, what is it that they are upset about
Him: They say it's because canada is going after the terrorists
Me: Who said? What Terrorists? What are they hoping to accomplish by doing this?
Him: It's Terrorism, Toronto is next.

So I just walked away.

A lot of people seem to jumping to the conclusion that this attack is linked to what happened in Quebec on Monday, and, while it may be, we just don't have any proof to link them together. It could be terrorism or it could be, as Nik said, good, old-fashioned crazy.

Sometimes the likeliest explanation is the correct one.

 

[bustaheims]

Sometimes the likeliest explanation is the correct one.

No, that's the simplest solution. There is no single likeliest explanation here right now. Not with the information we have available to us.

 

[TML fan]

Sometimes the likeliest explanation is the correct one.

No, that's the simplest solution. There is no single likeliest explanation here right now. Not with the information we have available to us.

If you say so.

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

I was just having this argument with a colleague at work.

Him: This is terrorism'
Me: ok, what's they're goal, what is it that they are upset about
Him: They say it's because canada is going after the terrorists
Me: Who said? What Terrorists? What are they hoping to accomplish by doing this?
Him: It's Terrorism, Toronto is next.

So I just walked away.

A lot of people seem to jumping to the conclusion that this attack is linked to what happened in Quebec on Monday, and, while it may be, we just don't have any proof to link them together. It could be terrorism or it could be, as Nik said, good, old-fashioned crazy.

Sometimes the likeliest explanation is the correct one.

And sometimes crazy people get inspired by other crazy people, regardless of whether there's any common motivations.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

I was just having this argument with a colleague at work.

Him: This is terrorism'
Me: ok, what's they're goal, what is it that they are upset about
Him: They say it's because canada is going after the terrorists
Me: Who said? What Terrorists? What are they hoping to accomplish by doing this?
Him: It's Terrorism, Toronto is next.

So I just walked away.

A lot of people seem to jumping to the conclusion that this attack is linked to what happened in Quebec on Monday, and, while it may be, we just don't have any proof to link them together. It could be terrorism or it could be, as Nik said, good, old-fashioned crazy.

Sometimes the likeliest explanation is the correct one.

And sometimes crazy people get inspired by other crazy people, regardless of whether there's any common motivations.

Just saw this posted on Twitter, it's Sir Ken MacDonald's response to the 7/7 London bombings and seems apt today:

 

[princedpw]

don't want to get to political here but I have one thought or question:  it seems the police knew that the extremist in Quebec whom ran over two of our soldiers (killing one) was planning acts of homegrown terror against us. If this is indeed a war then don't the old articles of war apply? And if they apply then cannot we call these non uniformed soldiers of radical Islam, Spys?  In the war if you were caught in civilian cloths behind enemy lines you could be summarily executed as a Spy.  Why are we waiting for documented spys planning acts of violence to us to actual act, if this is indeed a war??? And if this is not a war, then what is it? 

Well, until they're actually found doing something illegal, you can't punch them. Unless you catch them spying or with intelligence materials they're not supposed to have access to or anything else, they're innocent until proven guilty. Even those accused of espionage have to proven to have committed espionage before they could be executed. You can't have the government just arresting or killing people because they suspect they might commit a crime in the future. That's, you know, fascism.

Fascism, or, you know, US policy since Bush (ie: Guantanamo).

 

[princedpw]

I was just having this argument with a colleague at work.

Him: This is terrorism'
Me: ok, what's they're goal, what is it that they are upset about
Him: They say it's because canada is going after the terrorists
Me: Who said? What Terrorists? What are they hoping to accomplish by doing this?
Him: It's Terrorism, Toronto is next.

So I just walked away.

A lot of people seem to jumping to the conclusion that this attack is linked to what happened in Quebec on Monday, and, while it may be, we just don't have any proof to link them together. It could be terrorism or it could be, as Nik said, good, old-fashioned crazy.

Sometimes the likeliest explanation is the correct one.

And sometimes crazy people get inspired by other crazy people, regardless of whether there's any common motivations.

Just saw this posted on Twitter, it's Sir Ken MacDonald's response to the 7/7 London bombings and seems apt today:

+1

 

[Capn_Crunch]

A shot i saw from the game in Pitts tonight. Classy

 

[hockeyfan1]

Dead shooter image appeared to have been associated with a terrorist group Twitter account:

An image of Zehaf-Bibeau was first posted on a Twitter account associated with the Islamic State militant group, but the account has since been suspended.

PM Harper:
"Canada will never be intimidated"  and that the country will provide "no safe haven" for those responsible for the violent acts.

NDP leader Mulcair:
He pointed out that it is a time to stand in solidarity regardless of political affiliations.
"We will stand up. We will stand together. We will persevere and we will prevail," said Mulcair in a calm voice, adding that "tomorrow Canada will be strengthened."

Liberal leader Trudeau:
...there will be questions, anger and perhaps confusion. This is natural, but we cannot let it get the better of us. Losing ourselves to fear and speculation is the intention of those who commit these heinous acts."
"They want us to forget ourselves. Instead, we should remember," Trudeau said. "We should remember who we are. We are a proud democracy, a welcoming and peaceful nation, and a country of open arms and open hearts. We are a nation of fairness, justice and the rule of law."

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/uniformed-canadian-soldier-shot-at-ottawa-war-memorial-140825845.html

 

[hockeyfan1]

Gun-downed soldier killed by gunman while guarding the National War Memorial was identified as Corporal Nathan Cirillo, a reservist in the military.

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/uniformed-canadian-soldier-shot-at-ottawa-war-memorial-140825845.html

Condolences to the family.  And to any other innocent victims.

 

[Stickytape]

Gun-downed soldier killed by gunman while guarding the National War Memorial was identified as Corporal Nathan Cirillo, a reservist in the military.

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/uniformed-canadian-soldier-shot-at-ottawa-war-memorial-140825845.html

Condolences to the family.  And to any other innocent victims.

All along, Cpl. Nathan Cirillo had been guarding a monument that would ultimately commemorate his own death.

Something about that makes me want to take a nap for about a week.

 

[Highlander]

It will be an extra emotional Rememberance Day this year, with a member of a Highland unit being slaughtered on the sacred war memorial, where I have stood many a time over my years in Ottawa when I was taking my education. When I took my British wife to Ottawa that was the first place I took her, second was for a "Bloody" at the Chateau Laurier.  It has always been a deeply felt experience at the memorial as my dad fought in the RAF and other relatives perished in both Great Wars.

I know we are all deeply upset and I took some heat from Louis about this Bibeau being a radical extremist, which it turns out he was.
Interesting reporting on the National last night from Adrienne Arsanault  she said that about 90 passports have been revoked from predominetly young Canadians on suspicion of leaving to join ISIS.  Excuse my fascist ass but rounding up these 90 and taking them to a camp up north and feeding these losers until ISIS is toast is not that bad an idea, or we run the risk of more of these shooters entering our public places, malls, rinks, government offices, subways and more.
As Adrienne pointed out, these folks want to leave the country and go and fight with ISIS, because they can't leave they are much more likely to commit home grown terrorism than if we had let them leave. Perhaps we should have let them leave and then not let them come home. That may have been the best solution to all of this.