Trade Deadline

[Kin]

The reasons he gets beat at times like that have a lot more to do with decisions than his feet not keeping up with what his brain is telling them to do.

It's both. He lost the puck to Horton maybe because of decision making but being nowhere near him as Horton beat him down the ice is just a reflection of footspeed.

 

[Corn Flake]

I'm not so sure about that. The breakaway he gave up to Horton last night was a clear case of him not having anything resembling the ability to skate well. They were on even par at the blue line and by the redline Horton was 5 strides ahead of them. It's tough to explain considering it only takes 2 or 3 strides to cover that space usually.

That's probably because Phaneuf was starting at a stand-still and Horton was in mid-flight.  It's pretty damn tough to recover and catch someone from a stand-still unless you have elite skating - and not like Horton is particularly slow either.

exactly, plus how long had Phaneuf been on the ice when that happened... I'm guessing he wasn't fresh off the bench?  (Honestly haven't looked)

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

I don't really agree and I heard a lot of the same things said about Phaneuf a few years ago.

He's a 3rd pairing PP specialist. That's all he should be used for. Unfortunately, he's had a larger role for much of the season, and his defensive weaknesses - which includes his poor skating - have been exposed. The fact that he's a right-handed shot adds to his value some, but, he's also the worst skater on the blue line (by a wide margin compared to everyone other than Ranger), and he needs to go. Mobility is the key to the game these days, and Franson's mobility is not good enough.

Overall, I absolutely agree.  I think a few teams will see him as more than that is all I'm suggesting.  I think he's a bit better skater than given credit for a times but hey.. maybe it's just me seeing "potential" or something.

I said something similar about Franson in that he would do better in a situation where he didn't have to be the defensive guy on his pair. He needs to have a d-man he can lean on in that regard, not the other way around.

If the Leafs could move Franson and bring in a defensive d-man, even as a #6 who is reliable and can stabilize Gardiner or Rielly then our blueline could take a much needed turn for the better. Much like he and Fraser were last year before the wheels fell off this year.

I think Franson actually does quite well considering how slow he appears at times.  He may have been hurt a bit this year by no training camp too.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

I thought you meant for selling 'high' kind of purpose, being that prices are usually high at the deadline. For his salary, I don't mind his PK ability or playing the 4th line.

So I agree, you'd definitely wait and see how Bolland and McClement work in the 3 and 4 holes. Sort that out in the summer.

No, I am talking about selling high and moving them at the deadline. It's risky with Bolland's situation, but unless the doctors and everybody involved are just wildly inaccurate with their assessments of him he's going to be playing somewhat soon. And even if McClement is moved and Bolland isn't ready right away we can still run Bozak-Kadri-Kulemin-Holland for a few games.

 

[Kin]

exactly, plus how long had Phaneuf been on the ice when that happened... I'm guessing he wasn't fresh off the bench?  (Honestly haven't looked)

As someone who did watch it, I think all of us have seen enough instances of that play, where a defenseman fails to hold a line and  someone gets past him for a breakaway that we can still judge footspeed in that situation relative to other hockey players.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

Suggesting he "can skate" doesn't mean he's Bobby Orr.  It's not his skating that gets him into trouble.

His skating is absolutely part of what gets him into trouble.

I don't really agree and I heard a lot of the same things said about Phaneuf a few years ago.

I said the same thing about Phaneuf yesterday.

Yeah, I mean Phaneuf got walked around at least 3 times last night.

The reasons he gets beat at times like that have a lot more to do with decisions than his feet not keeping up with what his brain is telling them to do.

I'm not so sure about that. The breakaway he gave up to Horton last night was a clear case of him not having anything resembling the ability to skate well. They were on even par at the blue line and by the redline Horton was 5 strides ahead of them. It's tough to explain considering it only takes 2 or 3 strides to cover that space usually.

That's probably because Phaneuf was starting at a stand-still and Horton was in mid-flight.  It's pretty damn tough to recover and catch someone from a stand-still unless you have elite skating - and not like Horton is particularly slow either.

It's like you get a notice when someone says something poor about Phaneuf. ;D

I'm trying to find a clip of the Horton breakaway but haven't as of yet.

If I remember correctly though, Phaneuf and Horton battled for the puck at the blue line with Horton pushing the puck past Phaneuf and then walking around him to pick it up and subsequently blow Dion out of the water.

Now, I'll give you that Horton was facing the direction he wanted to go and therefore had the advantage as Phaneuf had to turn around but to say Horton was in mid flight is a bit of an exaggeration.
(As was my point that Phaneuf was 5 strides behind him by the red line).

Note: I was constantly rolling my eyes watching the game and my recollection of the play may be a bit clouded.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

No, I am talking about selling high and moving them at the deadline. It's risky with Bolland's situation, but unless the doctors and everybody involved are just wildly inaccurate with their assessments of him he's going to be playing somewhat soon. And even if McClement is moved and Bolland isn't ready right away we can still run Bozak-Kadri-Kulemin-Holland for a few games.

I don't mind that, but it's probably a bit lacking in the experience department if the Leafs have any aspirations of playing playoff hockey or doing anything in said playoffs.

Bolland to me is 100% about contract demands and if the high price is correct (rumoured), even the middle ground between the Leafs and him is a bit too much for me.

McClement on the other hand, if a team wants him bad enough and gives Nonis an inflated return, I think we could replace him from within and or in the summer. Not sure if that will happen though.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Suggesting he "can skate" doesn't mean he's Bobby Orr.  It's not his skating that gets him into trouble.

His skating is absolutely part of what gets him into trouble.

I don't really agree and I heard a lot of the same things said about Phaneuf a few years ago.

I said the same thing about Phaneuf yesterday.

Yeah, I mean Phaneuf got walked around at least 3 times last night.

The reasons he gets beat at times like that have a lot more to do with decisions than his feet not keeping up with what his brain is telling them to do.

I'm not so sure about that. The breakaway he gave up to Horton last night was a clear case of him not having anything resembling the ability to skate well. They were on even par at the blue line and by the redline Horton was 5 strides ahead of them. It's tough to explain considering it only takes 2 or 3 strides to cover that space usually.

That's probably because Phaneuf was starting at a stand-still and Horton was in mid-flight.  It's pretty damn tough to recover and catch someone from a stand-still unless you have elite skating - and not like Horton is particularly slow either.

It's like you get a notice when someone says something poor about Phaneuf. ;D

Well it was the thread I most recently commented in, not exactly digging through the boards to find this.

Will try to see if I can find the clip.

 

[Bullfrog]

It's like you get a notice when someone says something poor about Phaneuf. ;D

I'm trying to find a clip of the Horton breakaway but haven't as of yet.

If I remember correctly though, Phaneuf and Horton battled for the puck at the blue line with Horton pushing the puck past Phaneuf and then walking around him to pick it up and subsequently blow Dion out of the water.

Now, I'll give you that Horton was facing the direction he wanted to go and therefore had the advantage as Phaneuf had to turn around but to say Horton was in mid flight is a bit of an exaggeration.
(As was my point that Phaneuf was 5 strides behind him by the red line).

Note: I was constantly rolling my eyes watching the game and my recollection of the play may be a bit clouded.

I'm ok with the argument about Phaneuf's skating (though I think he's a decent skater.) However, this particularly play isn't a good example of his deficiency. He was caught standing still and had to turn. He didn't have a chance.

 

[iwas11in67]

Rumour - Brodeur to Minnesota

Sorry I deleted the email I received. Some beat reporter in NJ was reporting it.

 

[Zee]

Amazing the lack of rumors around the Leafs, either that means nothing at is happening, or Nonis and crew doesn't tip off anything.

 

[Jalili]

I go back and forth on how I'd label Phaneuf's skating.

He's got an ugly stride but he's always managed to get around. He was definitely a much more dynamic skater in his first few NHL years, but I mean, that's pretty much characteristic of a lot of players as they progress toward 30 and beyond.

And there are many guys around the league slower than he is (e.g. Chara or Markov) but when I look at the new breed of smooth skating D-men that have entered the league in the last few years, he doesn't hold up well against them.

So I guess it's really a matter of where you're drawing your comparisons.

 

[Kin]

I'm ok with the argument about Phaneuf's skating (though I think he's a decent skater.) However, this particularly play isn't a good example of his deficiency. He was caught standing still and had to turn. He didn't have a chance.

Except nobody is judging him solely by the fact that he didn't catch up. It was a perfect example of his skating speed in a flat footed situation which every player finds themselves in and which you can use to evaluate speed.

 

[bustaheims]

Rumour - Brodeur to Minnesota

Sorry I deleted the email I received. Some beat reporter in NJ was reporting it.

Doesn't seem like there's much to this one, considering this:

mirtle: I'm told Halak to the Wild is "close."

The Halak to Minnesota rumours have been swirling since before the Miller deal was official. The Brodeur stuff only came out after - like it was a negotiating tactic more than an actual trade that's going to happen.

 

[Britishbulldog]

Rumour - Brodeur to Minnesota

Sorry I deleted the email I received. Some beat reporter in NJ was reporting it.

Doesn't seem like there's much to this one, considering this:

mirtle: I'm told Halak to the Wild is "close."

The Halak to Minnesota rumours have been swirling since before the Miller deal was official. The Brodeur stuff only came out after - like it was a negotiating tactic more than an actual trade that's going to happen.

Brodeur or Brygalov.  Honest mistake by the NJ reporter.

 

[Bullfrog]

I'm ok with the argument about Phaneuf's skating (though I think he's a decent skater.) However, this particularly play isn't a good example of his deficiency. He was caught standing still and had to turn. He didn't have a chance.

Except nobody is judging him solely by the fact that he didn't catch up. It was a perfect example of his skating speed in a flat footed situation which every player finds themselves in and which you can use to evaluate speed.

Just to be nitpicky, that's actually a good situation to evaluate his acceleration and quickness at turning, not really his speed. I think he shows good speed when moving the puck up ice.

 

[Kin]

Just to be nitpicky, that's actually a good situation to evaluate his acceleration and quickness at turning, not really his speed. I think he shows good speed when moving the puck up ice.

If that's the case then 90% of what we talk about with regards to speed in the NHL is really acceleration and quickness at turning in which case, you know, the point stands. Dude is slow.

 

[Highlander]

With Loungo moving to Florida it does open up a possiblity of Reimer for Kessler and through in Bolland or Gardner or some picks.  Watching the last 3 games has changed my opinion on standing pat.

 

[bustaheims]

With Loungo moving to Florida it does open up a possiblity of Reimer for Kessler and through in Bolland or Gardner or some picks.  Watching the last 3 games has changed my opinion on standing pat.

I don't think it does. Vancouver is likely set on running with Lack/Markstrom for the rest of the season. If they do target a goalie, it will likely be someone more established than Reimer.

 

[Kin]

With Loungo moving to Florida it does open up a possiblity of Reimer for Kessler and through in Bolland or Gardner or some picks.  Watching the last 3 games has changed my opinion on standing pat.

I don't think it does. Vancouver is likely set on running with Lack/Markstrom for the rest of the season. If they do target a goalie, it will likely be someone more established than Reimer.

Or, at the very least, you'd have to figure that their potential interest in Reimer would be related to him being available for a relatively cheap price.