Unofficial 2013-2014 Armchair GM Thread
- Thread starter Champ Kind
- Start date
Britishbulldog
Active member
bustaheims said:
The more I think about the Leafs the more I am not sure how many moves at the forward position need to be introduced to add new players to the Leafs. Especially when you look at who is under contract next year and who is playing for the Marlies this year.
I an with you busta and I am firmly in the camp that the $3 MIL extra to get Statsny will not translate as a good commitment of cap space even if Bozak doesn't sustain his production.
I also am in the camp to give Clarkson 1 more year for the 3rd line.
Upfront I am getting more and more settled that the top 6 could handle the job if healthy and used properly by the coach.
I am also more settled that Raymond proved his critics right by disappearing in the last 12 games not even scoring a goal. He also shied away from any physical contact which really hurt the Leafs as the games increased with intensity. I would rather give one of the Marlies like Ashton, Leivo, D'Amigo, etc Raymond's spot.
I also don't like what Bolland is supposed to command since we have Kadri who will be looking to get another pay check next summer and Bozak is already signed for $4.2 MIL. I would give his spot to Holland.
The defense is a different story.
I've seen a lot of criticism of Raymond. Personally, I think he did pretty good for his price.
1M = 19G 26A 45P
I understand he didn't really do a whole lot else (not a big hitter or physical guy, not a big defensive guy) and certainly had some consistency issues, but for 1M, he provided some decent scoring depth for the team. I can't really be too upset with that.
1M = 19G 26A 45P
I understand he didn't really do a whole lot else (not a big hitter or physical guy, not a big defensive guy) and certainly had some consistency issues, but for 1M, he provided some decent scoring depth for the team. I can't really be too upset with that.
And along those lines, Lupul has also been criticised with having a bad year (and, admittedly, I've been critical of him too). But, when I look at his numbers, they're not that bad.
69GP 22G 22A 44P
Perhaps the criticism comes relative to last year where he and Kadri arguably over-produced? Perhaps his numbers are flattering to his overall play?
I guess this really applies to Kadri too.
76GP 20G 30A 50P
Again, good numbers for a 2nd line guy, yet some seem to be dissatisfied with him.
69GP 22G 22A 44P
Perhaps the criticism comes relative to last year where he and Kadri arguably over-produced? Perhaps his numbers are flattering to his overall play?
I guess this really applies to Kadri too.
76GP 20G 30A 50P
Again, good numbers for a 2nd line guy, yet some seem to be dissatisfied with him.
GhostofPotvin29
New member
AvroArrow said:
I don't think his numbers are necessarily bad, but he's also got a $5.25 million cap hit. If Clarkson wasn't around, I'm sure Lupul's contract would be criticized a lot more, but next to Clarkson's it looks like a steal. He had 79 points in 76 games before sustaining a concussion, and hasn't been the same since IMO. He hasn't come close to those PPG numbers since (hard to keep up but still) but more than that, and more than a few have commented on it, he seems to have lost his desire to go strong into the corners. That's where I think he was a real strong addition and where he generated a lot of chances from, using his size in the corners and in front of the net. This season he's felt much more like a perimeter guy to me, content to try and rely only on his hands.
Now that's not necessarily bad if you're, say, Phil Kessel who combines speed/hands/shot to put up a lot of points, but I can't help but feel that Lupul's game has been missing something this season.
Coco-puffs
New member
AvroArrow said:
I don't think anyone is dissatisfied with them offensively.... but defensively, its another story. Kadri is a -11... Lupul is a -15. I know the +/- stat is not always the best stat, but those numbers aren't lying about their play defensively this season. You can attribute part of that to a poor system... but I've seen execution issues for both of them all season. Lots of turnovers at our own blueline for Lupul. Shitty back-checking and puck watching instead of sticking with his man from Kadri.
Rebel_1812
New member
plus lupul is seen as a leader on the team that collapsed 3 years in a row. If we want to change the core, he is one of the guys to change.
Bullfrog
Active member
Potvin29 said:
He seemed to lack some intensity at times that I'm used to seeing out of him. I think his offensive production is right where we should be expecting though. It's very unlikely he'll get back up to PPG.
I wonder if the strain between him and Carlyle is returning and effecting his play?
Britishbulldog
Active member
Bullfrog said:
We were talking about that here during the last few games. Carlyle didn't trust him to play on the LW which Lupul now prefers. Same as Kulemin prefers playing the RW.
Carlyle has been playing Lupul on the RW again and Kulemin on the LW. I have found that so frustrating. I was wondering if Lupul did as well.
Rebel_1812 said:
Agreed - a change in core players is what is required after the epic failures of the past 3 years. Kessel/Lupul/Bozak/Kulemin/Phaneuf/Gunnar/Reimer - all played key roles in all 3 epic failures in the last 3 years. At least 2-4 of this core needs to change (Lupul/Reimer being the obvious targets).
I would also seriously consider trading Kessel for a bone-fide #1 Norris Caliber Defense-man that will be one for the next 5-10 years (don't know of any that are available as there are only handful of these guys out there). I'm not giving up on Kessel, but he is our #1 asset right now, and that's the only way to get that d-man that we need.
pmrules said:
I understand your idea, but then who do we trade to acquire the franchise forward that we need?
louisstamos
Active member
I posted this yesterday elsewhere on the 'net, figured I could re-post it here. I think a lot of it chronicles what others have suggested here that I by-and-large agreed with:
1) Fire Carlyle. Fire him hard. Into the sun. I'd say wait until locker clean out day, but I'm not sure I would make it that far. The advantage of doing it in the off-season is you don't have to jump the gun and name a replacement right away (which is how Carlyle got his job). Take the time and research potential candidates and find the right one. Kevin Dineen is a name that intrigues me. Steve Spott, although with only 1 year of AHL experience, has gotten a lot out of a young Marlies team that was supposed to take a step back this year, so you have to look at him as well.
2) As much as I love Reimer and would like to see him stay, with Bernier still in the fold I'm sure he's going to ask for a trade, and he should be accommodated. The issue is because of the way he was handled this year (*shakes fist at Carlyle*), his value probably isn't as high as it should be. Thus, I would package him with Cody Franson (who probably doesn't carry much either as an RFA with 1 year 'til UFA status), and try to get a 2 way-defenseman in return. Teams that could be potential targets are Winnipeg, NY Islanders, Vancouver, & Washington (maybe Calgary too). I'm not sure which D-men from those teams would be considered equal value, but I'd look long and hard at Dan Hamhuis (VAN, 2 years left 'til UFA, although has an NMC and is a BC native), especially if the Canucks decide that they are ?rebuilding? and trade Kesler & Edler, since he may not want to stick around for that. Clitsome from WPG is also a target (2 years 'til UFA). Alzner and Carlson from WSH (3 & 4 years left before UFA) are also options, although neither of them have had exceptional possession numbers in Washington. If no deal can be made, then I trade them both separately for picks.
3) UFA Players I let walk - Bolland, Raymond, McClement. Raymond was good this year, but is going to ask for (and justifiably deserve) a raise, and thanks to the Clarkson cap hit, I don't think he can fit under Toronto's cap for his role.
4) UFA Players I try and retain (if the price is reasonable) - Kulemin, Komarov, Bodie, Ranger. I feel like Kuli is going to go play with his buddy Malkin in Pittsburgh, but I'd offer him $3x3 in hopes that he'd stay, as he's an incredibly useful player to have. The Leafs missed Komarov in a big way this year - he's a fantastic skater, responsible positionally and hits in ways that causes turnovers. Not the greatest hands or possession numbers (the old adage is player who lead the league in hits does so because he never has the puck on the ice), but still good for a 4th line player. Ranger is fine as a #7 or as a leader for the Marlies if he?s willing to be on a similar contract. Ditto to Bodie.
5) Don't buyout Clarkson, maybe Gleason - the fact of the matter is, Clarkson's contract is buyout proof. I knew he was overpaid last summer, however, I expected him to be at least a competent 3rd line player, and he wasn?t even that. His value on the market is below mud right now ? you have to give him another year, and hope by SOME miracle he can produce better. I mean, statistically, he can?t be any worse than he was this past year. Gleason, while very good early on after the trade, tapered off as a Leaf before the end. He only has 2 years on his contract, though, so I think unless you have other plans/targets for that cap space (the UFA D-Men below), you keep him on for one more year and consider a buyout next summer. With Orr and MacLaren, I keep one of them around for the sheer fact that they?re best suited to sit in the pressbox night after night, and they both only have 1 year left on their deals. The one that doesn?t make it goes to the Marlies.
6) Hold on to as many picks as you can - the fact of the matter is, with rare exceptions, marquee players don't make it to UFA. The best way to get them is to draft and develop them. So do that. Gustav Nyqvist was a 4th round pick, and he nearly single-handedly dragged Detroit into the playoffs. So, unless you're getting a known commodity well-worth the price of the pick, use the pick and develop it properly.
7) No big splashes with UFAs ? the purpose here it to build a team that can skate, a competent 4th line that can play 8-10 minutes a game, and a D-corps that skates and moves the puck well and solid positionally (i.e: no more slow defenseman kept around for their ?toughness.? Team toughness is important, but I?d rather have 6 Duncan Keiths than 6 Luke Schenns). Possession-wise, Matt Niskanen is far and away the best UFA D-Man available, but is going to require too much money and term (thanks again for Clarkson, Nonis). If no D-Man can be had via trade for Reimer/Franson, I?d look at options on shorter contracts ? Kimmo Timmonen (39) is a good option, as would be Anton Stralman (27) as a younger option (although would require more term). Stephane Robidas (37) would have been as well, although because of his leg injury this year it would be a bit of a gamble on his mobility, but a short term contract would be fine. Matt Finn is a blue chip prospect coming up the pipeline, and Granberg , MacWilliam & Percy were very good for the Marlies this year and could make the jump next year, so I wouldn?t want anyone on a long-term deal coming in. For the 4th line, again, players that can skate, kill penalties, and not be a liability 5-on-5 is ideal. Brian Boyle (29) and Vernon Fiddler (33) would be two guys I look at. Lastly, a competent backup for Bernier is probably a good idea. Greiss and Peters are UFAs that would probably be cheap and reliable.
8) Let the kids play ? I would keep at least 2 or 3 spots on the team up for grabs at training camp for a rookie/Marlie to try and get. But by that same token, maybe you invite a UFA player who didn?t get a contract to camp on a tryout (much like Raymond last year). If one of the kids can outperform that player, then they?ve earned that spot. If not, back to the Marlies and you have that vet to plug into the lineup.
Ideal Lineup for Next Year?
JVR ? Bozak ? Kessel
Lupul ? Kadri ? Leivo
Kulemin ? Holland ? Clarkson
Komarov ? Boyle ? Bodie
ext: D?Amigo, MacLaren
Gunnarsson ? Hamhuis (against the opponent's top line)
Gardiner ? Phaneuf (almost exclusively with the 1st line)
Robidas ? Rielly
ext: MacWilliam
Bernier
Greiss
1) Fire Carlyle. Fire him hard. Into the sun. I'd say wait until locker clean out day, but I'm not sure I would make it that far. The advantage of doing it in the off-season is you don't have to jump the gun and name a replacement right away (which is how Carlyle got his job). Take the time and research potential candidates and find the right one. Kevin Dineen is a name that intrigues me. Steve Spott, although with only 1 year of AHL experience, has gotten a lot out of a young Marlies team that was supposed to take a step back this year, so you have to look at him as well.
2) As much as I love Reimer and would like to see him stay, with Bernier still in the fold I'm sure he's going to ask for a trade, and he should be accommodated. The issue is because of the way he was handled this year (*shakes fist at Carlyle*), his value probably isn't as high as it should be. Thus, I would package him with Cody Franson (who probably doesn't carry much either as an RFA with 1 year 'til UFA status), and try to get a 2 way-defenseman in return. Teams that could be potential targets are Winnipeg, NY Islanders, Vancouver, & Washington (maybe Calgary too). I'm not sure which D-men from those teams would be considered equal value, but I'd look long and hard at Dan Hamhuis (VAN, 2 years left 'til UFA, although has an NMC and is a BC native), especially if the Canucks decide that they are ?rebuilding? and trade Kesler & Edler, since he may not want to stick around for that. Clitsome from WPG is also a target (2 years 'til UFA). Alzner and Carlson from WSH (3 & 4 years left before UFA) are also options, although neither of them have had exceptional possession numbers in Washington. If no deal can be made, then I trade them both separately for picks.
3) UFA Players I let walk - Bolland, Raymond, McClement. Raymond was good this year, but is going to ask for (and justifiably deserve) a raise, and thanks to the Clarkson cap hit, I don't think he can fit under Toronto's cap for his role.
4) UFA Players I try and retain (if the price is reasonable) - Kulemin, Komarov, Bodie, Ranger. I feel like Kuli is going to go play with his buddy Malkin in Pittsburgh, but I'd offer him $3x3 in hopes that he'd stay, as he's an incredibly useful player to have. The Leafs missed Komarov in a big way this year - he's a fantastic skater, responsible positionally and hits in ways that causes turnovers. Not the greatest hands or possession numbers (the old adage is player who lead the league in hits does so because he never has the puck on the ice), but still good for a 4th line player. Ranger is fine as a #7 or as a leader for the Marlies if he?s willing to be on a similar contract. Ditto to Bodie.
5) Don't buyout Clarkson, maybe Gleason - the fact of the matter is, Clarkson's contract is buyout proof. I knew he was overpaid last summer, however, I expected him to be at least a competent 3rd line player, and he wasn?t even that. His value on the market is below mud right now ? you have to give him another year, and hope by SOME miracle he can produce better. I mean, statistically, he can?t be any worse than he was this past year. Gleason, while very good early on after the trade, tapered off as a Leaf before the end. He only has 2 years on his contract, though, so I think unless you have other plans/targets for that cap space (the UFA D-Men below), you keep him on for one more year and consider a buyout next summer. With Orr and MacLaren, I keep one of them around for the sheer fact that they?re best suited to sit in the pressbox night after night, and they both only have 1 year left on their deals. The one that doesn?t make it goes to the Marlies.
6) Hold on to as many picks as you can - the fact of the matter is, with rare exceptions, marquee players don't make it to UFA. The best way to get them is to draft and develop them. So do that. Gustav Nyqvist was a 4th round pick, and he nearly single-handedly dragged Detroit into the playoffs. So, unless you're getting a known commodity well-worth the price of the pick, use the pick and develop it properly.
7) No big splashes with UFAs ? the purpose here it to build a team that can skate, a competent 4th line that can play 8-10 minutes a game, and a D-corps that skates and moves the puck well and solid positionally (i.e: no more slow defenseman kept around for their ?toughness.? Team toughness is important, but I?d rather have 6 Duncan Keiths than 6 Luke Schenns). Possession-wise, Matt Niskanen is far and away the best UFA D-Man available, but is going to require too much money and term (thanks again for Clarkson, Nonis). If no D-Man can be had via trade for Reimer/Franson, I?d look at options on shorter contracts ? Kimmo Timmonen (39) is a good option, as would be Anton Stralman (27) as a younger option (although would require more term). Stephane Robidas (37) would have been as well, although because of his leg injury this year it would be a bit of a gamble on his mobility, but a short term contract would be fine. Matt Finn is a blue chip prospect coming up the pipeline, and Granberg , MacWilliam & Percy were very good for the Marlies this year and could make the jump next year, so I wouldn?t want anyone on a long-term deal coming in. For the 4th line, again, players that can skate, kill penalties, and not be a liability 5-on-5 is ideal. Brian Boyle (29) and Vernon Fiddler (33) would be two guys I look at. Lastly, a competent backup for Bernier is probably a good idea. Greiss and Peters are UFAs that would probably be cheap and reliable.
8) Let the kids play ? I would keep at least 2 or 3 spots on the team up for grabs at training camp for a rookie/Marlie to try and get. But by that same token, maybe you invite a UFA player who didn?t get a contract to camp on a tryout (much like Raymond last year). If one of the kids can outperform that player, then they?ve earned that spot. If not, back to the Marlies and you have that vet to plug into the lineup.
Ideal Lineup for Next Year?
JVR ? Bozak ? Kessel
Lupul ? Kadri ? Leivo
Kulemin ? Holland ? Clarkson
Komarov ? Boyle ? Bodie
ext: D?Amigo, MacLaren
Gunnarsson ? Hamhuis (against the opponent's top line)
Gardiner ? Phaneuf (almost exclusively with the 1st line)
Robidas ? Rielly
ext: MacWilliam
Bernier
Greiss
GhostofPotvin29
New member
AvroArrow said:
3 top pairing defensemen and 3 great-to-excellent forwards (give or take) and they're pretty deep all over. Not easily emulated I wouldn't think.
AvroArrow said:
Maybe not. But imagine this team without Phil Kessel for a second.
Apology accepted
Potvin29 said:
It was kind of a 'devil's advocate' question.
Comparatively, + Weber, - Kessel essentially sits us with 2 top pairing defensement (Phaneuf the other). We have JvR who's a great-excellent forward.
So, sure, we're missing a few pieces comparatively, but I wouldn't outright dismiss the idea just because we no longer have a franchise forward.
GhostofPotvin29
New member
AvroArrow said:
I think the difference is that their forwards, while they may not put up the highest point totals, are comparatively more in the Patrice Bergeron mold of legitimate 200-foot, physical players who are strong offensively and defensively. Bergeron doesn't light the offensive stat sheet on fire, but he's arguably just as important, if not more important, a player as a lot of the top scorers. I think that's where St. Louis is a very, very strong team.
