Carlyle Extended/Randy's Revenge

[93forever]

I hate this team.

Accountability.  Hold the players accountable...not the coach.

No matter how high we are in the chain of command, we are accountable to someone.  Making the coach unaccountable to anyone gives the coach the green light to coach in whatever manner he chooses without any repercussions. 

Now that Carlyle has been given a huge vote of confidence he better produce results.

 

[Madferret]

#CarlyleIn

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Unbelievable.  Loser organization rewards losing.

How is next year's draft looking?

Supposedly very good.

 

[Redleaf]

Like him or not, it appears Dave 'Status Quo' Nonis is rubbing off already on Shanahan.

Maybe he's setting them up for a common departure.

I don't see any quick fix here. The contracts and talent problem is bigger than the coaching problem. I'm convinced of that.

They might make the playoffs next year and they might not. If they fall short without major injuries excuses, I think Nonis & Carlyle will both be gone. And the real Shanahan era will begin.

The better bang for their talent buck players are generally free agents so they have a bit of a challenge to even stay where they are. I look at their situation and don't see an easy way out to become a real contender. Their top 5 paid forwards are locked in for at least four more years. Their top 3 paid dmen are locked in for at least two more years. And they've effectively made a commitment to Bernier.

They've burned their compliance buyouts.

They've spent $48 mil on 12 they're committed to next year
They've got $23 mil left to sign 11 more

So they're already cap constrained to not being able to do much in acquiring an impact player - if he's willing to come to a roster that doesn't look so hot.

Carlyle arguably underachieved and so those calling for his head have my sympathy. But I don't think Trotz or Tortorella or whoever is going to be able to make that much of a meaningful difference - not nearly as much as getting better talent for their NHL coach to work with.

In a year or two, when the Burke-Nonis retooling plan is more apparent that it's not very likely to pan out, the "real" Shanahan era will begin.

It is really hard to figure out this move to keep Carlyle, even though I agree that a coaching change wouldn't suddenly transform this club into something greater than the sum of its parts. It just seemed this club was in need of a fresh approach.

As others have pointed out, I'll be paying more attention now to who is brought in to 'assist' Randy behind the bench. Maybe Randy's new contract is more about keeping him around as a placeholder until the right man becomes available. It could be as simple as not seeing anyone else available they liked more? How about Steve Spott in a few years?

 

[Bender]

Listening to Randy in the presser makes me want to vomit. He keep saying they couldn't "convince" the players to play like the playoff teams are. If I were a player I'd be furious.

But its not like the media are doing much favours. Compete level. Are you kidding me? I hardly think this team would rather be losers than play competitive hockey. Good god, Im going to boycott this team.

Sent from my SGH-T889V using Tapatalk 4

 

[L K]

Listening to Randy in the presser makes me want to vomit. He keep saying they couldn't "convince" the players to play like the playoff teams are. If I were a player I'd be furious.

But its not like the media are doing much favours. Compete level. Are you kidding me? I hardly think this team would rather be losers than play competitive hockey. Good god, Im going to boycott this team.

A bad manager blames the pieces he has.  Leadership has to start with the coach in the dressing room.

 

[Kin]

A bad manager blames the pieces he has.  Leadership has to start with the coach in the dressing room.

It's a poor carpenter that blames his tools but it's a reasonable carpenter who knows there's only so much you can do with plywood.

 

[Wendel's Fist]

So Mike Babcock gets his team into the playoffs with a bunch of injuries, is a Jack Adams finalist and Detroit still isn't sold on giving him an extension yet.

The Vancouver Canucks miss the playoffs for the first time in God knows how many years and they fire their coach with 4 years left on his contract. Plus the GM.

The Toronto Maple Leafs not only miss the playoffs for the eighth time in the last nine years, they also set a record for most shots on goal allowed in a season and we give our coach an extension.

Mind-boggling doesn't even begin to describe it.

 

[cw]

Like him or not, it appears Dave 'Status Quo' Nonis is rubbing off already on Shanahan.

Maybe he's setting them up for a common departure.

I don't see any quick fix here. The contracts and talent problem is bigger than the coaching problem. I'm convinced of that.

They might make the playoffs next year and they might not. If they fall short without major injuries excuses, I think Nonis & Carlyle will both be gone. And the real Shanahan era will begin.

The better bang for their talent buck players are generally free agents so they have a bit of a challenge to even stay where they are. I look at their situation and don't see an easy way out to become a real contender. Their top 5 paid forwards are locked in for at least four more years. Their top 3 paid dmen are locked in for at least two more years. And they've effectively made a commitment to Bernier.

They've burned their compliance buyouts.

They've spent $48 mil on 12 they're committed to next year
They've got $23 mil left to sign 11 more

So they're already cap constrained to not being able to do much in acquiring an impact player - if he's willing to come to a roster that doesn't look so hot.

Carlyle arguably underachieved and so those calling for his head have my sympathy. But I don't think Trotz or Tortorella or whoever is going to be able to make that much of a meaningful difference - not nearly as much as getting better talent for their NHL coach to work with.

In a year or two, when the Burke-Nonis retooling plan is more apparent that it's not very likely to pan out, the "real" Shanahan era will begin.

It is really hard to figure out this move to keep Carlyle, even though I agree that a coaching change wouldn't suddenly transform this club into something greater than the sum of its parts. It just seemed this club was in need of a fresh approach.

As others have pointed out, I'll be paying more attention now to who is brought in to 'assist' Randy behind the bench. Maybe Randy's new contract is more about keeping him around as a placeholder until the right man becomes available. It could be as simple as not seeing anyone else available they liked more? How about Steve Spott in a few years?

I suspect whacking the entire assistant coaching staff is a little unfair. It strikes me more probably as a PR case of serving a few  heads on a platter to placate fans for the shortcomings of the team than something Carlyle decided - particularly when it's all three. He goes back a fair way with ex-Leaf Dave Farrish who used to coach the Leafs ECHL team in Pensacola and helped Carlyle win a Cup in Anaheim.

Farrish was Carlyle's only pick of the three assistants he had - which I kind of question. The coach isn't the GM who picks the players .. and then they weigh in and dictate who is going to be his assistants too? Coaches get fired so frequently, you'd think they'd earn more than one pick for their assistant coach.

Assistant coaches being retained during a coaching change does seem to happen more frequently these days in the NHL.

Having said that, maybe I'm wrong and a part of their findings were the coaching staff wasn't getting along so they cut those guys loose. Who knows for sure?

 

[Tigger]

Nonis "He has done a lot of good things for us and we expect him ( Carlyle ) to continue that with some new assistants, moving forward, and to put us back in the postseason. As a management group this is the first step into reshaping the team and how it will look and play in the fall..."

...to me, emphasis on 'postseason'.

"I don't blame the assistant coaches for what went wrong, I can again say that a lot of the positives that we have had over the last two years, specifically I think overachieving as a group in the shortened season..."

Well, there you go.

Nice nod to Randy to say that he wasn't throwing his guys under the bus for 'change' to occur at the BS level, though, it did seem like 'communication' was a note that helped to sink them. Man, these guys are good...

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

I wish Nonis had to actually explain what the good things he's done for the team are.

 

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

So Mike Babcock gets his team into the playoffs with a bunch of injuries, is a Jack Adams finalist and Detroit still isn't sold on giving him an extension yet.

The Vancouver Canucks miss the playoffs for the first time in God knows how many years and they fire their coach with 4 years left on his contract. Plus the GM.

The Toronto Maple Leafs not only miss the playoffs for the eighth time in the last nine years, they also set a record for most shots on goal allowed in a season and we give our coach an extension.

Mind-boggling doesn't even begin to describe it.

Bravo sir.

 

[bustaheims]

I wish Nonis had to actually explain what the good things he's done for the team are.

He was behind the bench when Reimer dragged the team into the playoffs in a lockout shortened season?

 

[Derk]

Yeah, wow. I heard this today and simply could not believe my ears. Not only is he coming back, but he is getting extended too. I would like to think that there is a plan, but right now I don't know what to believe.

 

[Hampreacher]

This does not make sense. Yes it is nice to have your system as a coach but you coach with what you have. Carlyle refused to do that. He refused to play 4 lines as other teams did plus insisted on playing Orr and McClement. I see wholsale changes coming.

 

[93forever]

Maybe I am wrong in this quote, but I thought I heard Carlyle mention at the end of the game 7 debacle against the Bruins that one of the assistants wanted to call a timeout during the 3rd period but Carlyle overruled him.  A voice of reasoning gets canned while the mind of incompetence gets extended.  The assistants take the fall for Carlyle's incompetence.  Way to go !!!

The Leafs have made some boneheaded decisions in the past but this one tops them all.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

?To me it?s a simple answer,? Nonis said. ?If you?ve seen it done before with the same players, or most of the same players, and with that coach leading that group, I know it can happen. I know it has happened with this group before. I know that he has reached them before, reached them at times this year.

?We?re not guessing whether or not he can have success. We?ve seen it. I know it?s there, and we feel that he is the guy that can get through to this group.?

They're still clinging to that 48 game season as more representative than this 82 game season.

I also laugh when Carlyle says they wanted the team to play more like the playoff teams are playing.  Okay?  Any joe blow off the street could want the same thing, your one job is to have the team play the way you want it to play.  They're obsessed with an "identity."  Make your "identity" be a good hockey team.

 

[93forever]

I wish Nonis had to actually explain what the good things he's done for the team are.

He encouraged Clarkson to sign with the Leafs.

Oh wait, never mind.  Bad thought.

 

[TML fan]

A bad manager blames the pieces he has.  Leadership has to start with the coach in the dressing room.

It's a poor carpenter that blames his tools but it's a reasonable carpenter who knows there's only so much you can do with plywood.

Carlyle isn't either of those.

 

[93forever]

A bad manager blames the pieces he has.  Leadership has to start with the coach in the dressing room.

It's a poor carpenter that blames his tools but it's a reasonable carpenter who knows there's only so much you can do with plywood.

Carlyle isn't either of those.

Well Carlyle is a bit of a tool...