Coronavirus

[Highlander]

I want to make it crystal clear, I am not advocating anything to anyone, I mentioned that if I could get said chemical, which won't be named then "I" would get it. Nothing to do with anyone else.

And I am not propagating conspiracy theories which I personally think of as nonsense.

Nuff said.

 

[Bender]

There seems to be no way out with this COVID-19 virus.  It?s almost as if the virus likes to pick and choose who it will infect.
This stealth virus has all the makings of a cleverly mutated bio engineered product, despite science disputing this claim.  Then again, how can we be so certain of that as well?

Stop with the baseless conspiracy theories. They don't help anyone.

My 2nd reminder: anti-vaccine and conspiracy theories regarding COVID-19 have no place here. I'll leave this post up to serve as an example.

These views are garbage even on the best of days but people are DYING here. I don't expect anyone else on these boards to have an issue following this simple directive but I just wanted to repeat it once again.

Why do you get to decide what others think or post? You probably not mind folks using Dr Tam's word yet She is still touting the absolute BS that masks don't work? Let the reader decide their own opinions. This whole pandemic is an example of opinions and facts changing.

She hasn't said that fyi. Shockingly there is nuance to the subject.

https://twitter.com/CPHO_Canada/status/1245514639418494976?s=19

 

[Bender]

It's not the first thing you have tried to sanction. You also tried when folks wrote about alternative medicine.

And will continue to do so, thanks. If you have a problem with that feel free to find another Toronto Maple Leafs forum that allows that sort of discussion.

Until hydroxychloroquine is proven effective by something like the CDC, WHO, or PHAC it won't be discussed here. Someone has DIED because of misinformation regarding that specific treatment already. I'm sorry for missing the original post about it yesterday.

People, the team lets you discuss pretty much anything you want here regarding the Maple Leafs or hockey in general. I'm taking a hard stance here on COVID-19 and I won't apologize for it.

Someone died by ingesting a fish tank chemical, I thought you wanted to be factual?

You're being disingenuous with how you're presenting that.

Trump has been advocating the use of chloroquine/hydroxychloroquine. He has been very vague as to anything else regarding the treatment, even being cavalier in whether he calls it chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine. It is incumbent on leaders who aren't in medicine to not give medical advice and especially not add in "what have you got to lose?" People are scared and afraid and the people you mentioned who got sick (one who died) saw that chloroquine was on the shelf in their house and they didn't understand the difference between pharmaceutical chloroquine/hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine not meant for human consumption.

If you want we can throw that case out. Maybe you think they're just stupid and it's their own fault they took something non-prescribed. Fine. If people start asking to be prescribed hydroxychloroquine, now without symptoms because Trump keeps touting the treatment publicly and it's sticking to the panicked public's brains, besides the run on the actual medication that's used to treat things like Lupus that these people need, it also reduces its availability to actually treat COVID. At best it is unsolicited, questionable advice, at worst it will cause needless deaths.

If I gave unsolicited advice in my profession, especially advice I wasn't qualified to give or if it was ethically questionable I would be heavily fined or fired.

Secondly this technically isn't a public message board, and moderators are given the ability to moderate discussion for that purpose. Like CtB said, there's plenty of boards to talk about "alternative" medicine. It doesn't have to be here.

 

[Bender]

so why don't we allow a thread called "whacky conspiracy theories" and if people want to read about such things they can. The base line is we probably will never know for absolute sure where this thing originated from.

No. Just follow simple rules.

I'm sure I speak for a lot of us in saying that I don't want this board to become a murdoch-esque tabloid.

 

[louisstamos]

There is some positive news to report on this front, though - a few weeks ago, Sunnybrook Hospital - in conjunction with the University of Toronto and MacMaster University, were able to isolate the virus, which allows for more accurate testing and being able to grow the virus in a lab - https://sunnybrook.ca/research/media/item.asp?c=2&i=2069&f=covid-19-isolated-2020&fbclid=IwAR3ZESLvk0ENqqRR4EsPEQlWmWefwvHf9X_J8OZ1QGyhBtMgU-vXAyP-0aM

Because of that research, the University of Saskatchewan was able to develop a prototype vaccine, which actually passed the first step and has moved on to testing on ferrets this week - https://globalnews.ca/news/6762600/coronavirus-saskatoon-vido-covid-19/

We're still a long ways away from the vaccine being made available to the public for consumption, but these are very positive steps.

 

[Bates]

There seems to be no way out with this COVID-19 virus.  It?s almost as if the virus likes to pick and choose who it will infect.
This stealth virus has all the makings of a cleverly mutated bio engineered product, despite science disputing this claim.  Then again, how can we be so certain of that as well?

Stop with the baseless conspiracy theories. They don't help anyone.

My 2nd reminder: anti-vaccine and conspiracy theories regarding COVID-19 have no place here. I'll leave this post up to serve as an example.

These views are garbage even on the best of days but people are DYING here. I don't expect anyone else on these boards to have an issue following this simple directive but I just wanted to repeat it once again.

Why do you get to decide what others think or post? You probably not mind folks using Dr Tam's word yet She is still touting the absolute BS that masks don't work? Let the reader decide their own opinions. This whole pandemic is an example of opinions and facts changing.

She hasn't said that fyi. Shockingly there is nuance to the subject.

https://twitter.com/CPHO_Canada/status/1245514639418494976?s=19

On Monday, at a briefing in Ottawa, though, Dr. Theresa Tam, chief public health officer of Canada, said that Canada is not now planning to change its advice, for two reasons. Firstly, because there is a shortage of masks for health workers.

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Secondly, it is not clear that masks actually help prevent infections, and may increase the risk for those wearing them.

?What we worry about is actually the potential negative aspects of wearing a mask, where people are not protecting their eyes, or other aspects of where the virus could enter your body, and that gives you a false sense of confidence,? she said. ?But also it increases the touching of your face. If you?ve got a mask around your face sometimes you can?t help it because you?re just touching parts of your face. The other thing is the outside of the mask could be contaminated.?

 

[Bates]

That advice is contradicted by the World Health Organization, the government of Canada and federal public health officials like Chief Public Health Officer Dr. Theresa Tam. On its webpage, the WHO says that "if you are healthy, you only need to wear a mask if you are taking care of a person with suspected [COVID-19] infection."

"Putting a mask on an asymptomatic person is not beneficial, obviously, if you're not infected," Tam said Monday.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

I want to make it crystal clear, I am not advocating anything to anyone, I mentioned that if I could get said chemical, which won't be named then "I" would get it. Nothing to do with anyone else.

Except that it's irrelevant that you're not advocating it for others. That isn't the line that Carleton clearly set. You were asked to stop, and you're still trying to justify it.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

That advice is contradicted by the World Health Organization, the government of Canada and federal public health officials like Chief Public Health Officer Dr. Theresa Tam. On its webpage, the WHO says that "if you are healthy, you only need to wear a mask if you are taking care of a person with suspected [COVID-19] infection."

"Putting a mask on an asymptomatic person is not beneficial, obviously, if you're not infected," Tam said Monday.

Most of what I've read regarding the garden variety n95 type masks is pretty consistent - it can have some benefit for reducing the potential for passing the virus on, but isn't considered effective for protection. The higher grade protective masks/shields with eye protection etc are a different story, and I wish there was more of it to go around for the front line health care workers.

 

[Highlander]

I want to make it crystal clear, I am not advocating anything to anyone, I mentioned that if I could get said chemical, which won't be named then "I" would get it. Nothing to do with anyone else.

Except that it's irrelevant that you're not advocating it for others. That isn't the line that Carleton clearly set. You were asked to stop, and you're still trying to justify it.

I think in a free world and society, as per Bates that we have the ability to say what we feel and what is on our minds, hell I started this thread.
I am not a health care worker or a Doctor, even though many of my friends are. Some agree with your post on eye protection, one of my best friends is an infectious disease guy, who has urged us to wear the largest glasses we can when we are out.    Frycer14 are you a health care worker or Doctor?  I would appreciate knowing. 
I will not be posting any more information on drugs or other treatments. I trust this helps CTB and you and any other who are offended by my posts.

 

[Highlander]

There is some positive news to report on this front, though - a few weeks ago, Sunnybrook Hospital - in conjunction with the University of Toronto and MacMaster University, were able to isolate the virus, which allows for more accurate testing and being able to grow the virus in a lab - https://sunnybrook.ca/research/media/item.asp?c=2&i=2069&f=covid-19-isolated-2020&fbclid=IwAR3ZESLvk0ENqqRR4EsPEQlWmWefwvHf9X_J8OZ1QGyhBtMgU-vXAyP-0aM

Because of that research, the University of Saskatchewan was able to develop a prototype vaccine, which actually passed the first step and has moved on to testing on ferrets this week - https://globalnews.ca/news/6762600/coronavirus-saskatoon-vido-covid-19/

We're still a long ways away from the vaccine being made available to the public for consumption, but these are very positive steps.

Louis, you are not allowed to post this, as per the thought police.

 

[L K]

There is some positive news to report on this front, though - a few weeks ago, Sunnybrook Hospital - in conjunction with the University of Toronto and MacMaster University, were able to isolate the virus, which allows for more accurate testing and being able to grow the virus in a lab - https://sunnybrook.ca/research/media/item.asp?c=2&i=2069&f=covid-19-isolated-2020&fbclid=IwAR3ZESLvk0ENqqRR4EsPEQlWmWefwvHf9X_J8OZ1QGyhBtMgU-vXAyP-0aM

Because of that research, the University of Saskatchewan was able to develop a prototype vaccine, which actually passed the first step and has moved on to testing on ferrets this week - https://globalnews.ca/news/6762600/coronavirus-saskatoon-vido-covid-19/

We're still a long ways away from the vaccine being made available to the public for consumption, but these are very positive steps.

Louis, you are not allowed to post this, as per the thought police.

Pat yourself on the back for this.  Stop being a jackass.

 

[Bender]

There is some positive news to report on this front, though - a few weeks ago, Sunnybrook Hospital - in conjunction with the University of Toronto and MacMaster University, were able to isolate the virus, which allows for more accurate testing and being able to grow the virus in a lab - https://sunnybrook.ca/research/media/item.asp?c=2&i=2069&f=covid-19-isolated-2020&fbclid=IwAR3ZESLvk0ENqqRR4EsPEQlWmWefwvHf9X_J8OZ1QGyhBtMgU-vXAyP-0aM

Because of that research, the University of Saskatchewan was able to develop a prototype vaccine, which actually passed the first step and has moved on to testing on ferrets this week - https://globalnews.ca/news/6762600/coronavirus-saskatoon-vido-covid-19/

We're still a long ways away from the vaccine being made available to the public for consumption, but these are very positive steps.

Louis, you are not allowed to post this, as per the thought police.

This is backed by science by reputable hospitals. You must know that this is different than saying something based on 0 scientific or credible evidence.

 

[Bender]

That advice is contradicted by the World Health Organization, the government of Canada and federal public health officials like Chief Public Health Officer Dr. Theresa Tam. On its webpage, the WHO says that "if you are healthy, you only need to wear a mask if you are taking care of a person with suspected [COVID-19] infection."

"Putting a mask on an asymptomatic person is not beneficial, obviously, if you're not infected," Tam said Monday.

My rebuttal is to your part saying she is still spouting mask bs etc. and I think that tweet did it's job in refuting that argument. What was said a week ago is outdated. 

 

[Bates]

That advice is contradicted by the World Health Organization, the government of Canada and federal public health officials like Chief Public Health Officer Dr. Theresa Tam. On its webpage, the WHO says that "if you are healthy, you only need to wear a mask if you are taking care of a person with suspected [COVID-19] infection."

"Putting a mask on an asymptomatic person is not beneficial, obviously, if you're not infected," Tam said Monday.

My rebuttal is to your part saying she is still spouting mask bs etc. and I think that tweet did it's job in refuting that argument. What was said a week ago is outdated.

So if the study Canada is currently part of for the not to mentioned treatment gets proven to work we can then mention it?? But not while they are testing it, just once the results are in?? Gotcha

 

[Bender]

That advice is contradicted by the World Health Organization, the government of Canada and federal public health officials like Chief Public Health Officer Dr. Theresa Tam. On its webpage, the WHO says that "if you are healthy, you only need to wear a mask if you are taking care of a person with suspected [COVID-19] infection."

"Putting a mask on an asymptomatic person is not beneficial, obviously, if you're not infected," Tam said Monday.

My rebuttal is to your part saying she is still spouting mask bs etc. and I think that tweet did it's job in refuting that argument. What was said a week ago is outdated.

So if the study Canada is currently part of for the not to mentioned treatment gets proven to work we can then mention it?? But not while they are testing it, just once the results are in?? Gotcha

I have no idea what you're trying to convey here. The previous parts of the thread talking about hydroxychloroquine isn't here so I don't really know what they said. Are you referring to a study on masks or something? I think debating whether a drug works or not is pretty ridiculous for this type of site and is something best left to scientists and health care professionals. Wearing a mask is a different debate because you aren't ingesting a chemical without any trials and has more nuance to it than you're leading on. I'm not going to get mad at people who wear masks but I am going to be annoyed at people who think a cotton mask is the same as a surgical mask/N95 or use it as a pretext to keep going out or that it's some kind of pancea that has 0 trade offs in terms of risk. But again, that's a much different discussion.

I think my position is pretty clear and I don't really have anymore time or energy dealing with disingenuous posts or baiting or whatever it is you're trying to do. If you want to get into more detail on a platform with basically no guidelines get on twitter or something.

 

[Bates]

That advice is contradicted by the World Health Organization, the government of Canada and federal public health officials like Chief Public Health Officer Dr. Theresa Tam. On its webpage, the WHO says that "if you are healthy, you only need to wear a mask if you are taking care of a person with suspected [COVID-19] infection."

"Putting a mask on an asymptomatic person is not beneficial, obviously, if you're not infected," Tam said Monday.

My rebuttal is to your part saying she is still spouting mask bs etc. and I think that tweet did it's job in refuting that argument. What was said a week ago is outdated.

So if the study Canada is currently part of for the not to mentioned treatment gets proven to work we can then mention it?? But not while they are testing it, just once the results are in?? Gotcha

I have no idea what you're trying to convey here. The previous parts of the thread talking about hydroxychloroquine isn't here so I don't really know what they said. Are you referring to a study on masks or something? I think debating whether a drug works or not is pretty ridiculous for this type of site and is something best left to scientists and health care professionals. Wearing a mask is a different debate because you aren't ingesting a chemical without any trials and has more nuance to it than you're leading on. I'm not going to get mad at people who wear masks but I am going to be annoyed at people who think a cotton mask is the same as a surgical mask/N95 or use it as a pretext to keep going out or that it's some kind of pancea that has 0 trade offs in terms of risk. But again, that's a much different discussion.

I think my position is pretty clear and I don't really have anymore time or energy dealing with disingenuous posts or baiting or whatever it is you're trying to do. If you want to get into more detail on a platform with basically no guidelines get on twitter or something.

Nothing disingenuous about it. I simply questioned why the need to censor posters just because you don't agree with their posts.  I was told the only acceptable posts are those approved by Health Canada or WHO or similar. I don't think they have been exactly factual on this crisis as the mask writings proved. And the treatment we could not discuss is now actual in study by Canada?? But the point of my post was to allow open discussion not echo chamber like this place has been shifting towards.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/malaria-drug-being-studied-on-the-list-of-possible-covid-19-treatments-tam-1.4883377

 

[Kin]

There are literally thousands if not millions of places on the Web were you can discuss anything in any manner you like. I personally think swearing is good and fine and adds to the language and the idea of "bad words" is silly but the rules here are no swearing so I don't swear here but curse a blue streak elsewhere.

Right now they're looking at dozens of drugs to see if they work. Nothing anyone has said amounts to "You can't say a certain drug is being studied" but rather "With all of the confusion and fear and uncertainty out there, this board shouldn't be used to propagate potentially dangerous information, such as a drug that is still being studied and that has consequences for being used incorrectly has been proven effective" or, say, that this looks like a biological weapon when there's no evidence whatsoever for that and Asian people are increasingly becoming the target of harrassment because of people who believe it.

This board has always had rules, made by admins and enforced by mods and contrary to what people think they've always governed content as well as just decorum. We aren't supposed to gossip about player's personal lives, for instance. I once got told I wasn't allowed to make fun of a certain way a hockey personality spoke. Those rules were here before anyone started posting, they existed while we were posting and if any of us decides we don't want to follow them then they'll be here when we're gone.

 

[Kin]

And if anyone is curious:

https://www.tmlfans.ca/community/index.php?topic=317.0

2. The site staff have the exclusive right and discretion to delete any posts they deem to be in contravention to these rules and guidelines, and subsequently ban repeat offenders, if necessary.

 

[Kin]

I don't want to repeat it but let's be clear, earlier in this thread someone posted a tweet from someone who said that the Coronavirus was "overhyped" and that people should "Enjoy their planned vacation". That was on March 3rd.

The virus, as of now, is responsible for almost 70,000 reported deaths. That number is going to rise dramatically in the weeks and months ahead. Men, women and children are going to die. Travelling is one of the major causes of its spread. In an effort to save lives and protect the people risking themselves to treat us, the government has taken steps that will see thousands of people lose their jobs. This is not "overhyped".

Putting bad information out there right now isn't just a matter of differing opinion or the free exchange of ideas. It is genuinely dangerous for us all. Our grandparents knew what that was like. They lived during a war, a period where people didn't get to do whatever they wanted all the time and were seen as real pieces of dirt if they weren't contributing to the effort. If people can't pull together for common good now because they might even have to follow the simplest and most basic rules on a private web forum...then god bless you, I hope you and your family stay healthy but I hope you never post here again.