Downtown Connor Brown Re-signed 3 x $2.1

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Bargain per @LeafsPR.

 

[herman]

Hot diggity I thought it'd be 3M for 4 years.
How the hell did we get him for less than Hyman or Martin?
(No UFA years)

 

[ZBBM]

Hot diggity I thought it'd be 3M for 4 years.
How the hell did we get him for less than Hyman or Martin?
(No UFA years)

Could make him very attractive in a trade for a defenseman.

 

[herman]

Keeping him bridged to an RFA negotiation sounds like Brown is in the long-term plans with opportunity for him to play into a raise, and he sounds like he is such a homer that he agreed to the lower $ to keep the band together.

 

[princedpw]

Given Hyman's deal, this does not seem fair to brown.

 

[Kin]

Given Hyman's deal, this does not seem fair to brown.

You're paying for UFA years with Hyman, not for Brown.

I personally don't see the wisdom in keeping either guy around for much longer but if you're going to you still have to deal with them on that basis to some extent.

 

[freer]

Given Hyman's deal, this does not seem fair to brown.

You're paying for UFA years with Hyman, not for Brown.

I personally don't see the wisdom in keeping either guy around for much longer but if you're going to you still have to deal with them on that basis to some extent.

I dont understand your last statement why wouldn't you want to sign player who scored 20 goals as a rookie in Brown. You should ask why they would pay 6.5 mil for a 37 year old player

 

[Kin]

I dont understand your last statement why would want to sign player who scored 20 goals as a rookie in Brown. You should ask why they would pay 6.5 mil for a 37 year old player

I don't understand your first sentence as it seems to be missing a couple of words.

Re: Marleau I think I made my thoughts pretty clear on that in the thread on his deal.

 

[BrownRolo]

Given Hyman's deal, this does not seem fair to brown.

You're paying for UFA years with Hyman, not for Brown.

I personally don't see the wisdom in keeping either guy around for much longer but if you're going to you still have to deal with them on that basis to some extent.

You don't see the wisdom of keeping them around? Then who do you suggest takes their place?

 

[Kin]

You don't see the wisdom of keeping them around? Then who do you suggest takes their place?

Well, in Brown's case I think that's an already answered question. Right now the Leafs depth chart at RW has, or should have, three guys on it in Marner, Nylander and Kapanen who are younger and better. So the easy answer is Kapanen who, last year, scored at a AHL rate better than Brown ever achieved. So who should replace him as 4th on the depth chart? Well, a lot of the Leafs remaining prospect depth is at RW(Korshkov, Bracco, Grundstrom) so in the short-medium term there should be lots of options internally.

With Hyman I don't think we need to worry too much about finding someone who can replace the player he is now because he's sort of a hybrid 3rd-4th liner(Leipsic would have been my choice but c'est la vie).

 

[Kin]

I dont understand your last statement why wouldn't you want to sign player who scored 20 goals as a rookie in Brown.

Oh, I definitely think they should have signed him. Him signed to a reasonable deal makes him a more valuable trade asset than him unsigned. I just think he's 4th on the RW depth chart with a bunch of good young RW prospects behind him so I think it won't be long before you can replace him internally and get better/younger/cheaper.

 

[BrownRolo]

You don't see the wisdom of keeping them around? Then who do you suggest takes their place?

Well, in Brown's case I think that's an already answered question. Right now the Leafs depth chart at RW has, or should have, three guys on it in Marner, Nylander and Kapanen who are younger and better. So the easy answer is Kapanen who, last year, scored at a AHL rate better than Brown ever achieved. So who should replace him as 4th on the depth chart? Well, a lot of the Leafs remaining prospect depth is at RW(Korshkov, Bracco, Grundstrom) so in the short-medium term there should be lots of options internally.

With Hyman I don't think we need to worry too much about finding someone who can replace the player he is now because he's sort of a hybrid 3rd-4th liner(Leipsic would have been my choice but c'est la vie).

I don't know. I like Kapanen a lot but I wouldn't slot him above Brown just yet. Hyman is certainly replaceable but he fills a need.

They signed 3 and 4 year deals so don't know what you mean by keeping them around much longer. You mean trade them this season?

 

[Kin]

I don't know. I like Kapanen a lot but I wouldn't slot him above Brown just yet. Hyman is certainly replaceable but he fills a need.

They signed 3 and 4 year deals so don't know what you mean by keeping them around much longer. You mean trade them this season?

Well, I think I'm being intentionally vague there. I don't think there's any immediate need to trade either guy but I can't really see them sticking around past the extensions they just signed either so the team should be aware of that and be open to possibilities of moving them.

With regards to Brown vs. Kapanen while we may disagree about where they are now(again, I think Kapanen was a better AHL player than Brown was and to my eye looked at least to be his equal as a player in his short NHL stint) I think it's fair to say that Kapanen is probably a better long-term bet because of his relative youth.

In the immediate sense, the Leafs will have enough cap room before their big extensions kick in that even if I'm right and Kapanen establishes himself as the #3 guy at RW this year that Brown on the 4th line and doing PK duties is fine for now. Once those extensions kick in though then 2+ million 4th liners is a luxury you probably can't maintain for long.

The only caveat there is that, again, if I'm right and Kapanen is the #3 guy then Brown is going to have a lot of trouble re-creating his offensive output from last year. So trading him beyond this year might get you less if you're not trading him as a "23 year old 20 goal scorer" but a 24 year old 4th liner but, again, if that's a risk the team wants to take I don't think it's a calamity or anything.

That said, you do have to weigh that risk against what we could say would really be the loss between having Brown in that 4th line RW and whoever would replace him...Sosh or Leivo or someone. Is it a lot? Eh.

Anyways, my feelings here have less to do with me and my thoughts on Brown(outside of thinking he's not super-important to the team's future) and more to do with the fact that NHL teams can really only play four RW's.

 

[herman]

I'd be pretty sour if we kept Hyman beyond his contract.

Brown I can see keeping even with the RW depth. He's #3 behind Marner and Kapanen because Nylander is not going to be a winger for much longer (and can fill in LW where we are shallower if so).

Bracco is really the only RW on the Marlies at the moment who might start knocking on the door so our timeframe still looks okay. Korshkov and Grundstrom, while listed as RWs, played their off-wing (same as Kapanen, Nylander, Soshnikov) as the European ice lends itself to more lateral room and decreasing the benefit of having a strong-side stick on defending. Johnsson and Timashov are the other LWs of note coming up.

 

[Kin]

I'd be pretty sour if we kept Hyman beyond his contract.

Brown I can see keeping even with the RW depth. He's #3 behind Marner and Kapanen because Nylander is not going to be a winger for much longer (and can fill in LW where we are shallower if so).

Bracco is really the only RW on the Marlies at the moment who might start knocking on the door so our timeframe still looks okay. Korshkov and Grundstrom, while listed as RWs, played their off-wing (same as Kapanen, Nylander, Soshnikov) as the European ice lends itself to more lateral room and decreasing the benefit of having a strong-side stick on defending. Johnsson and Timashov are the other LWs of note coming up.

They won't be playing on European ice over here though and both guys are pretty fair bets to spend some time with the Marlies before the NHL at which point presumably you're going to want to spend time getting them acclimated to NHL style defensive work. 

Regardless, that still brings us back to the reality of the Leafs having depth at wing. Even if Brown is "only" third on the RW depth chart once Nylander moves to C at some point in the future, he's still there behind two guys who are very young and figure to be with the team for a very long time. The team simply doesn't have that sort of depth at any other position.

At some point the Leafs are going to have to, if they ever want to make trades to address areas of weakness, identify players on their roster who are good and have value and be willing to trade them. Brown fits that criteria right now in a way that very few others on the club do.

 

[cujo4ever]

I think this is a team friendly contract, nice signing by Brown. I wouldn't be surprised to see him score another 20 goals this year. He shot over 14% last season while playing mostly with Matthews and Kadri, but I think he still has some growth left in his game. 2.1 mil for a guy who scores 20 goals is a great deal.

PPP has a good writeup on Brown, they ranked him #6 in their Top 25 under 25 series (https://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/toronto-maple-leafs-top-25-prospects-under-25/2017/8/25/16027464/top-25-under-25-2017-toronto-maple-leafs-connor-brown-new-contract-2017-18-nhl-season-stats)

 

[herman]

They won't be playing on European ice over here though and both guys are pretty fair bets to spend some time with the Marlies before the NHL at which point presumably you're going to want to spend time getting them acclimated to NHL style defensive work. 

Regardless, that still brings us back to the reality of the Leafs having depth at wing. Even if Brown is "only" third on the RW depth chart once Nylander moves to C at some point in the future, he's still there behind two guys who are very young and figure to be with the team for a very long time. The team simply doesn't have that sort of depth at any other position.

At some point the Leafs are going to have to, if they ever want to make trades to address areas of weakness, identify players on their roster who are good and have value and be willing to trade them. Brown fits that criteria right now in a way that very few others on the club do.

Yeah those two will be LW when they come into our system to acclimate to the reduced space.

Basically everyone under the Big Three should be available if the right offer comes along (maybe even the third one). The trick is to build up their value while they cost us pennies. I think you're right that Brown is in and will be in that sweet spot of great trade value for a good stretch.

 

[Heroic Shrimp]

I'm stunned at the price and can't believe he's getting paid less than Hyman.  Great deal.

 

[AvroArrow]

Nice deal!  Glad to have such a versatile player on our hands.

 

[Kin]

Basically everyone under the Big Three should be available if the right offer comes along (maybe even the third one). The trick is to build up their value while they cost us pennies. I think you're right that Brown is in and will be in that sweet spot of great trade value for a good stretch.

And just philosophically, I think we need to be less attached to players who while they may be good, can be replaced. If, going forward, the group of Nylander, Kadri, Matthews, Marner and Kapanen are going to hold 5 of the 6 Top 9 spots at C and RW(regardless of where Nylander ends up) then I think you're going to want to at least keep your options open with that 6th spot.

Again, if Nylander is a RW for the next year or so then we should at least acknowledge the potential of Brown being the 4th line RW in that time. If that's the case can he build and maintain trade value? I don't know.