Goaltending Showdown - Reimer vs. Bernier

[Strangelove]

I'd say there's a roughly zero percent chance Reimer gets the start.  Bernier is the clear number one at this point and is playing great.

Reimer's been sort of shaky recently, and on the whole doesn't have the upside thag Bernier has, which is why the latter has gotten more rope to get into a groove this season.  It seems like management made a decision quite a while ago, and it's one I agree with.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Been very happy with Bernier lately, although I have confidence in Reimer too.

 

[Andy007]

I guess the numbers do favour Bernier but it's not exactly a clear runaway. Reimer's SP is .919 (vs.927) and, despite having a higher GAA (3.00 vs 2.55/2.60) he has a better winning percentage. Also, he hasn't really had a change to get into a groove and string appearances together; he's put up those stats after being off for significant periods of time.

I'm not really trying to advocate for one goalie over the other, I just don't think there has been a huge difference between the two and that Reimer's stats aren't exactly being helped by playing every 3rd/4th game. 

 

[Damian]

I wouldnt be suprised if Carlyle called "shutout" between the 2nd and 3rd because Reimer was in there...

 

[ZBBM]

To judge by the points in the MotM thread, Reimer's play is just about at the same level as Bernier's.

Or you could just go by actual, unbiased stats, which L K pointed out a few posts above, that show Bernier's play has been at a higher level than Reimer's.

Or you could actually read LK's comments that accompany the stats to understand that all stats need to be interpreted.

 

[Bonsixx]

To judge by the points in the MotM thread, Reimer's play is just about at the same level as Bernier's.

Or you could just go by actual, unbiased stats, which L K pointed out a few posts above, that show Bernier's play has been at a higher level than Reimer's.

Or you could actually read LK's comments that accompany the stats to understand that all stats need to be interpreted.

Oh I did. And I interpret better save percentages as equating to better performances.

You're clearly in the Reimer camp, and that's fine, he's a good goalie. But Bernier has been better and they're not suddenly going to try to shove Reimer back out there while Bernier is playing so well because James is a nice guy.

 

[Highlander]

Lets remember we are in a win-win situation here so why bitch.  We have two first string goalies battling it out for # 1.  What is not to like?

 

[Bonsixx]

Lets remember we are in a win-win situation here so why witch.  We have two first string goalies battling it out for # 1.  What is not to like?

If this all shakes down the way I expect, with Bernier eventually earning the starter's job (if he hasn't already), I'd be ecstatic if Reimer signed a reasonable new deal and stayed on as a back-up who played 30 games or so. I think he has the right attitude to excel in that role.

Of course, I'm sure he may want to explore starting opportunities elsewhere, but I'm not sure he'd ever land in a spot where the team wouldn't always look to upgrade.

 

[ZBBM]

To judge by the points in the MotM thread, Reimer's play is just about at the same level as Bernier's.

Or you could just go by actual, unbiased stats, which L K pointed out a few posts above, that show Bernier's play has been at a higher level than Reimer's.

Or you could actually read LK's comments that accompany the stats to understand that all stats need to be interpreted.

Oh I did. And I interpret better save percentages as equating to better performances.

You're clearly in the Reimer camp, and that's fine, he's a good goalie. But Bernier has been better and they're not suddenly going to try to shove Reimer back out there while Bernier is playing so well because James is a nice guy.

Actually, I'm not at all.  If anything I prefer Bernier just because of the style he plays.  Solid positionally = likely longer career.

And their stats both show declines over the season and aren't that far apart.  So I give more credence to the accolades than you do.

 

[Bonsixx]

How is Bernier's .932 in December and .916 in January "not that far apart" from Reimer's .909 and .893 in those months?

 

[losveratos]

How is Bernier's .932 in December and .916 in January "not that far apart" from Reimer's .909 and .893 in those months?

Not that I would agree with them being not that far apart... but maybe it's because even if the goalie sees a full 40 shots (which I'm hoping will continue to happen less) that doesn't equate an extra goal. It's an extra goal every 50-60 shots. But that's assuming his save percentage stays as it was in those months. There was a time this year when Reimers save %age was at the very top of the entire league. These things ebb and flow.

I usually don't read much into month by month save %ages because they vary so wildly throughout the year. What I would look at however is that Bernier is a .927 for the year and Reimer is .919. So a difference over the year of .08. Meaning an extra goal every 125 shots or so and the average shots per game over the year is about 36. Meaning an extra goal every 3 and a half games.

Now I love having a better goalie right now in Bernier... but I don't think he's clearly proven or shown anything other than being a little more than marginally better.

I wouldn't go trading Reimer for a bag of magic beans just yet.

 

[Andy007]

How is Bernier's .932 in December and .916 in January "not that far apart" from Reimer's .909 and .893 in those months?

Over that span of time, Bernier has had almost twice as many appearances.

 

[Hampreacher]

One could argue that Reimer has proven himself in playoff situations, whereas Bernier has not. I like them both.

 

[ZBBM]

How is Bernier's .932 in December and .916 in January "not that far apart" from Reimer's .909 and .893 in those months?

Uh, because a difference of 0.23 is not that far apart.  Note that both goalies' stats when down in tandem, pretty much reflecting the rest of the team's lousy play.

 

[Zee]

How is Bernier's .932 in December and .916 in January "not that far apart" from Reimer's .909 and .893 in those months?

Uh, because a difference of 0.23 is not that far apart.  Note that both goalies' stats when down in tandem, pretty much reflecting the rest of the team's lousy play.

A save % difference of 0.23 is significant.  A goalie with a .923% is a starting goalie, a goalie with a .900 save % is a backup.

 

[ZBBM]

How is Bernier's .932 in December and .916 in January "not that far apart" from Reimer's .909 and .893 in those months?

Uh, because a difference of 0.23 is not that far apart.  Note that both goalies' stats when down in tandem, pretty much reflecting the rest of the team's lousy play.

A save % difference of 0.23 is significant.  A goalie with a .923% is a starting goalie, a goalie with a .900 save % is a backup.

The scope of the difference is really a matter of opinion, isn't it?

EDIT: BTW, we are arguing over old news.  I just checked and Bernier is at .927, Reims at .919.  Surely THAT isn't considered much of a difference.

 

[dappleganger]

There's no denying Bernier has been the better goalie statistically.

 

[Bender]

There's no denying Bernier has been the better goalie statistically.

Your DP made me lol at work.

 

[bustaheims]

EDIT: BTW, we are arguing over old news.  I just checked and Bernier is at .927, Reims at .919.  Surely THAT isn't considered much of a difference.

It's a difference of about 20 goals a season for an average NHL team. About 24 for the Leafs, based on their current shots against pace.

 

[Boston Leaf]

well they were equal last night. Equally bad  :-\