Leafs @ Bruins - Dec. 8th, 7:00pm EST - CBC
- Thread starter Kin
- Start date
ZBBM
Active member
Yeah, really. Sorry azzurri, I don't accept that you deserve to get hit if you are stationary against the boards and watching a pass you just made. You are done with the play for the moment. You aren't skating and the puck is now nowhere you.
Hyman changed course to hit McAvoy. He hit him with his shoulder, near his head. I don't like the Bruins much but they reacted just the way I would expect them to. They know McAvoy just came back from a concussion, and they know that Hyman knows too. Do I think Hyman was trying to concuss McAvoy again? No, he's not nearly that stupid. But I don't think you can expect your opponent to give you the benefit of the doubt.
Per Frank's comment, the Kronwall hit was not the same. Matthews was playing the puck, not just standing there. Yes, it was a dirty hit, but Matthews just happened to go into the boards shoulder-first. Hard to argue that Kronwall was trying to do that.
Hyman changed course to hit McAvoy. He hit him with his shoulder, near his head. I don't like the Bruins much but they reacted just the way I would expect them to. They know McAvoy just came back from a concussion, and they know that Hyman knows too. Do I think Hyman was trying to concuss McAvoy again? No, he's not nearly that stupid. But I don't think you can expect your opponent to give you the benefit of the doubt.
Per Frank's comment, the Kronwall hit was not the same. Matthews was playing the puck, not just standing there. Yes, it was a dirty hit, but Matthews just happened to go into the boards shoulder-first. Hard to argue that Kronwall was trying to do that.
ZBBM
Active member
herman said:
These responses miss the point: when you are playing the team that cleaned your clock in G7 last spring, you don't want to come out of their building totally embarrassed, especially playing a depleted group. Sure it's an emotional reaction. Our job as fans includes that stuff.
Bullfrog
Active member
Nik the Trik said:
I actually agree with you completely. These are absolutely the types of hits that need to be removed from the game. The intent of hitting is to knock someone off the puck; it shouldn't be to injure. Hitting someone who is defenseless (for whatever reason) is just dangerous.
My previous post was more about the current game and warranted discipline. It was clearly late, but I didn't see this hit as being overly malicious. It could have been significantly worse. Knowing the current state of the game (i.e. that these hits still happen frequently); McAvoy should have been more aware. That's not to put any blame on him (sexy clothes shouldn't get you raped and all that...)
Kin
New member
Bullfrog said:
I may have come off there a little more tart then I intended but all I was saying is that both you and TML Fan seemed to be implying that, if McAvoy wasn't to blame, that his watching the play at least constituted a mitigating factor here. All I was saying really was that the reason he was watching the play is because the puck was nowhere near him and, as a result, watching the play and not expecting to get hit is pretty reasonable on his part.
If someone wanted to categorize this hit more in the "careless act" pile rather than a deliberate and malicious attempt to injure I think that's defensible, alls I'm saying is that between the two players involved here describe the one watching the play as being somehow "unaware" or lacking in judgement seems off to me.
Bullfrog
Active member
No worries, I didn't perceive you coming off as tart. I'm not suggesting McAvoy's lack of awareness was a mitigating factor (this is all on Hyman). For me, it was more of a comment that McAvoy should be aware that he's in a somewhat vulnerable position. This, despite the fact that I believe it shouldn't be a vulnerable position if these blind-side hits weren't tolerated.
For the record, your second paragraph is how I view it. Definitely a careless act by Hyman, but I don't see it as an attempt to injure. It's "off" because the wacky NHL culture allows for these late hits that have nothing to do with the play.
In short:
1. McAvoy should have been better prepared
2. It's sad that he needs to be better prepared after simply making a pass
3. Hyman is a bad man because he made a careless hit on an unsuspecting opponent
4. Hyman isn't that bad of a man, because the hit wasn't particularly violent
5. The NHL's culture is stupid and so is its rationale for discipline
For the record, your second paragraph is how I view it. Definitely a careless act by Hyman, but I don't see it as an attempt to injure. It's "off" because the wacky NHL culture allows for these late hits that have nothing to do with the play.
In short:
1. McAvoy should have been better prepared
2. It's sad that he needs to be better prepared after simply making a pass
3. Hyman is a bad man because he made a careless hit on an unsuspecting opponent
4. Hyman isn't that bad of a man, because the hit wasn't particularly violent
5. The NHL's culture is stupid and so is its rationale for discipline
Kin
New member
Bullfrog said:
Ehhh, this might just be where we have to disagree. Guys make similar plays hundreds of times without getting hit because they're pretty confident that, having ensured that the puck is no where near them, nobody is going to hit them. Players don't have eyes in the back of their heads and they're always going to be vulnerable to some extent to someone hitting them from behind.
Bullfrog
Active member
What if I rephrased it?: McAvoy would be wise to be better prepared.
I think the key for a disagreement is probably our opinion on the degree of lateness. I agree it was a late hit, but I honestly don't think it was that late. As in, it was within a timeframe during which a player would be wise to be more aware that some jackass might make a late hit.
I think the key for a disagreement is probably our opinion on the degree of lateness. I agree it was a late hit, but I honestly don't think it was that late. As in, it was within a timeframe during which a player would be wise to be more aware that some jackass might make a late hit.
Kin
New member
Bullfrog said:
I don't mean to disagree with you again but in a way I don't really think it's about the lateness of the hit. Or, to find some common ground, I think it might be about what we're saying was late about the hit. You might be timing it from when the puck touches McAvoy's stick to when Hyman hits him. Which is how the rulebook works and how you define late hits and, like you say, still makes this a late hit.
But if you look at it from when Hyman should have recognized that McAvoy was going to make the standard play there of going around the boards to the other side, and thereby making hitting him a bad play, to when he hit him then it's a different time frame and I think it looks worse for Hyman.
So I think it's maybe just a difference of perspective. I count a full one mississippi from when McAvoy has the puck to when Hyman hits him which is bad enough but to me I see that play and read it as Hyman is the guy showing a lack of awareness.
Brain fart from Hyman... oops that?s not how you hit, I guess I have to fight now. Oops, I jerseyed the guy and he doesn't have tie-down (I guess he's done too). Oops, I am beating this guy up after I through the cheap shot. I should stop fighting now. What just happened? Really, you're kicking ME out, I write children's books.
Hyman seems like a really intelligent guy and seems like the type to figure things out methodically. I think he knew Boston was taking liberties and his calculator told him to fill a void (which he is making a career of), he's just not the guy for toughness void.
Hyman seems like a really intelligent guy and seems like the type to figure things out methodically. I think he knew Boston was taking liberties and his calculator told him to fill a void (which he is making a career of), he's just not the guy for toughness void.