R1G1: Leafs @ Bruins - May 1st, 7:00pm - CBC, TSN 1050

[hockeyfan1]

The Leafs looked like they may have been surprised by the intensity of playoff hockey tonight.

The Bruins may turn out to be the first, or second best team in the east this year, but really, when Nonis decided not to make any major moves at the deadline and go with the youth (as many had hoped he would), should we be surprised by this kind of result? (at least after game one)

Experience is not overrated in the Stanley Cup playoffs. This is what we have. They're the youngest team in the league. We should at least acknowledge this fact as fans.

Let's hope Carlyle can make the necessary adjustments for a win on Saturday!

GLG!!

This is exactly how I feel as well Redleaf.

Leafs are the youngest team in the league going against an experienced and playoff hardened team that has won the Stanley Cup as a group.

I think it is a perfect way to measure the Leafs Stanley Cup readiness.

Go Leafs!!

I, too, agree with this assessment.  While Carlyle has every right to be upset about this loss, it goes to show how passionate Randy is to want to win in spite of the fact that his team is largely playoff inexperienced.

Next game, there should be no excuse for the entire team to not show up, so to speak, now that they have tasted opening playoff 'jitters' and what-have-you.  As Kadri so confidently stated that this series is winnable.  Let's hope so.

Onto Game 2!!

 

[Sudafederov]

They have to put this game behind them and focus on Saturday like it is a game 7 because it might as well be a game 7.

Going down 2-0 and having to win 4 of 5 against Boston just won't happen in this series.

Quoting, not shouting:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=31154

COMEBACKS FROM TRAILING 2-0 IN GAMES

TEAMS HAVE TRAILED 2-0 IN A BEST-OF-SEVEN SERIES A TOTAL OF 291 TIMES AND HAVE COME BACK TO WIN THE SERIES ON 37 OCCASIONS OR 12.7% OF THE TIME.

 

[L K]

THe cool thing is that Komarov is the one who had to fight at the end of the game.  What the bloody hell is the point of Colton Orr/Kyle McLaren when they NEVER fight to get the team going.  They have their useless fights against other goons (where were the goons in the Boston's lineup?) and they do nothing against guys who can actually play hockey.

The blueline was garbage the whole night for the Leafs.  Too many guys who can't pass the puck and the forwards were way too tentative coming through the neutral zone and they kept losing pucks by trying to skate the puck in rather than dumping and chasing (Boston does a good job of committing just enough interference to slow down the forecheck but not draw penalties).

I'm not sure what game Carlyle was watching to suggest that Kostka had a good game.  He was garbage all night.  He was committing as many turnovers as the rest of the D.  He was on the ice for Boston's goals and was a direct cause of the first one.  Beyond that he had 2-3 2+ minute shifts of 5 on 5 hockey because he couldn't get off the ice.  That's unacceptable, and if that was Grabovski/Kadri/MacArthur doing that, Carlyle benches them for the rest of the game or puts them further down the depth chart.  But not in Randy's world where the team plays passive 80% of the time and expects to win games. 

I honestly hope they fire Carlyle in the offseason and bring up Dallas Eakins.  Not because I think Dallas is necessarily going to get more out of the roster, but I really don't want to lose him to another organization and I'm just not seeing how Carlyle's hockey is going to translate into playoff success.  Prove me wrong though.  Have the team actually come out with fire next game.  I just have a hard time seeing it when he can't get the team motivation coming out of the intermissions.  What does he bother to do in the dressing room.  The Leafs came out flat in the 2nd AND 3rd periods and didn't remotely shows signs of trying to send a message for the next game.

Also, why does the Orr line come out after every goal scored against?  I don't get it.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

Stack a couple scoring lines, cut down Grabo's ice-time drastically (watching him getting ragdolled all over the place is tiresome) and maybe you'll at least be competitive out there.

Two things.

You can't cut down Grabovski's ice time because he was the best forward on the ice last night.

You also can't cut down Grabovski's ice time because Kadri cannot be trusted nor can he win face offs.

 

[lc9]

Really embarrassing that Carlye feels the need to dress both Orr and McLaren in a playoff game and then give them 10 minutes of ice time. There won't be any fights and those two just can't skate well enough to play in this atmosphere. 

Leafs will get swept with that lineup.  Awful.

 

[Corn Flake]

Really embarrassing that Carlye feels the need to dress both Orr and McLaren in a playoff game and then give them 10 minutes of ice time. There won't be any fights and those two just can't skate well enough to play in this atmosphere. 

Leafs will get swept with that lineup.  Awful.

They got 10 mins because of the fact the game was out of hand in the 3rd. They were out there to hit and cause trouble and they were probably the best line all night at gaining the offensive zone and causing havoc around Rask.  That's why they got so much ice.

You think dropping the two most physical guys on this team will help deal with the fact the Leafs were out muscled last night? 

Our 4th line matches up to Boston's with the exception of Paille vs. McLaren, which really isn't much of a downgrade in the grand scheme. 

Give or take,
Orr = Thornton
McClement > Campbell
McClaren < Paille

You can argue that Thornton is marginally more effective than Orr at times but it's not like the Leafs have some giant trade off here with that comparison.  McClement is a far better player than Campbell just not quite as physical and Paille can do more than McClaren but in some ways I would take the physical play.

Also in the 1st, that line was very effective at getting under the B's skin without taking any bad penalties.  They had Chara getting all bent out of shape early on.  Exactly what they are supposed to do.

To me the LAST thing I'm concerned about after last night is what the 4th line was doing. 

Let's talk about how 5/6 of our defense were completely overwhelmed by the B's forecheck. 

 

[Corn Flake]

You also can't cut down Grabovski's ice time because Kadri cannot be trusted nor can he win face offs.

Grabbo was great.  Going to the dirty areas all night and he paid the price.  Loved it.  Most we've seen out of him all year.  Not surprised he would rise to the occasion in the playoffs.  He and JVR were the best forwards. 

He needs linemates he has chemistry with.. putting him back with Mac and Kulemin is probably a good thing.  Kadri can play with Lupul and Komarov which is what I think we saw in the 3rd.  That would give the Leafs 3 lines with chemistry. 

Agree on Kadri.  He will be better but he was looking pretty overwhelmed last night, especially in his zone.  His faceoff issues are well known, plus vs. the best team in the league at it isn't going to help that.  Komarov should probably take the faceoffs for that line.

 

[lc9]

They got 10 mins because of the fact the game was out of hand in the 3rd. They were out there to hit and cause trouble and they were probably the best line all night at gaining the offensive zone and causing havoc around Rask.  That's why they got so much ice.

You think dropping the two most physical guys on this team will help deal with the fact the Leafs were out muscled last night? 

I don't think they were good on the ice at all.  I thought they were slow and out of position.  Yes, I do thinking dropping the two worst skaters is a good idea, this is playoff hockey, the Leafs need players who can skate, not players who are trying to goon it up.  Orr doesn't even look like he can make it from end to end without falling down.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Really embarrassing that Carlye feels the need to dress both Orr and McLaren in a playoff game and then give them 10 minutes of ice time. There won't be any fights and those two just can't skate well enough to play in this atmosphere. 

Leafs will get swept with that lineup.  Awful.

They got 10 mins because of the fact the game was out of hand in the 3rd. They were out there to hit and cause trouble and they were probably the best line all night at gaining the offensive zone and causing havoc around Rask.  That's why they got so much ice.

You think dropping the two most physical guys on this team will help deal with the fact the Leafs were out muscled last night? 

Our 4th line matches up to Boston's with the exception of Paille vs. McLaren, which really isn't much of a downgrade in the grand scheme. 

Give or take,
Orr = Thornton
McClement > Campbell
McClaren < Paille

You can argue that Thornton is marginally more effective than Orr at times but it's not like the Leafs have some giant trade off here with that comparison.  McClement is a far better player than Campbell just not quite as physical and Paille can do more than McClaren but in some ways I would take the physical play.

Also in the 1st, that line was very effective at getting under the B's skin without taking any bad penalties.  They had Chara getting all bent out of shape early on.  Exactly what they are supposed to do.

To me the LAST thing I'm concerned about after last night is what the 4th line was doing. 

Let's talk about how 5/6 of our defense were completely overwhelmed by the B's forecheck.

They got zone time in the 3rd once the Bruins let up some.  They can still hardly handle the puck.  They managed 5:00 or something through 2 periods and were scored on.

But regardless of how they did last night, there are better hockey players that can be dressed, and in Frattin's case, can still be physical.  Not going to be fighting, so dress the better hockey players.  There is no reason our 4th line should be matched up over half of their minutes against Jagr's line through 2 periods.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Remember, we lost 5-0 to Ottawa in Game 1 in 2002, and got dominated the first 2 games against the Wings in 1993.

Optimism.  8)

 

[Corn Flake]

They got zone time in the 3rd once the Bruins let up some.  They can still hardly handle the puck.  They managed 5:00 or something through 2 periods and were scored on.

But regardless of how they did last night, there are better hockey players that can be dressed, and in Frattin's case, can still be physical.  Not going to be fighting, so dress the better hockey players.  There is no reason our 4th line should be matched up over half of their minutes against Jagr's line through 2 periods.

I think Boston is the last team you want to not dress your *most* physical players against.  That said, I might dress Frattin over McLaren next game for the added speed. 

I still like what Orr & McLaren did early on whether or not they can handle the puck. They were up in Chara's kitchen a few times as well as others early on.  Frattin can go check Chara but you think he's going to be bothered by it? Nope.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

They got zone time in the 3rd once the Bruins let up some.  They can still hardly handle the puck.  They managed 5:00 or something through 2 periods and were scored on.

But regardless of how they did last night, there are better hockey players that can be dressed, and in Frattin's case, can still be physical.  Not going to be fighting, so dress the better hockey players.  There is no reason our 4th line should be matched up over half of their minutes against Jagr's line through 2 periods.

I think Boston is the last team you want to not dress your *most* physical players against.  That said, I might dress Frattin over McLaren next game for the added speed. 

I still like what Orr & McLaren did early on whether or not they can handle the puck. They were up in Chara's kitchen a few times as well as others early on.  Frattin can go check Chara but you think he's going to be bothered by it? Nope.

You think Chara's going to be bothered by two 4th line fighters? Nope.  Every team in the league goes at him.

I don't think with any configuration we're going to out-physical Boston, they're a bigger team.  I think our best bet is to use our team speed, which I think is better than Boston.  That's why I'm in favour of dressing better players.  Physical teams don't look as hot when you expose them with speed instead of trying to just match them in physicality.

But I expect we'll see some minor forward change like Frattin for MacArthur, or just shuffling the lines.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

@RealKyper

Word out of Boston. #Bruins Ference will have an #NHL discipline hearing mid-afternoon 2day for his elbow on #Leafs Grabovski.

 

[crazyperfectdevil]

Remember, we lost 5-0 to Ottawa in Game 1 in 2002, and got dominated the first 2 games against the Wings in 1993.

Optimism.  8)

really?  from reading things around here today i was under the impression that no team has ever come back from losing the first game

 

[cw]

Even when the Leafs scored first, I didn't have a good feeling. I wondered if this would be the only moment they would be ahead in this series.

I think there's more going on than a lack of playoff experience. The game struck me a little like boys against men. The Leafs might have more scoring skill but the Bruins play smarter and simpler, work together better as a team and seemed to dominate in the puck battles. And even then, I didn't get the feeling the Bruins were really on their game and playing well - yet they pretty much dominated.

Sure Orr & McLaren add toughness but the good playoff teams have guys who can do something close to that while still contributing better hockey.

I don't know what O'Byrne did to lose his spot to Kostka. He shows up and goes +4 and 28 hits over 8 games while on the ice for only 2 even strength goals against. Liles has to play with a guy like that against a club like the Bruins. Maybe he's hurt? I don't understand it otherwise.

The game reminded me more of the Sabres physical domination of the '99 Leafs than the Borchevsky '93 Leafs upset of the Wings. I was left wondering if the Ference elbow to Grabovski would be symbolic of this series.

I'm naturally hoping for the best (maybe a miracle) but to me, that game illustrated how tough it's going to be and sucked some of the hope out of me.

I'm with others about Saturday. The chances of this club coming back to win 4 out of 5 against this Bruins team seems extremely remote. Reimer needs to stand on his head or something to steal a win on Saturday.

 

[crazyperfectdevil]

Even when the Leafs scored first, I didn't have a good feeling. I wondered if this would be the only moment they would be ahead in this series.

I think there's more going on than a lack of playoff experience. The game struck me a little like boys against men. The Leafs might have more scoring skill but the Bruins play smarter and simpler, work together better as a team and seemed to dominate in the puck battles. And even then, I didn't get the feeling the Bruins were really on their game and playing well - yet they pretty much dominated.

Sure Orr & McLaren add toughness but the good playoff teams have guys who can do something close to that while still contributing better hockey.

I don't know what O'Byrne did to lose his spot to Kostka. He shows up and goes +4 and 28 hits over 8 games while on the ice for only 2 even strength goals against. Liles has to play with a guy like that against a club like the Bruins. Maybe he's hurt? I don't understand it otherwise.

The game reminded me more of the Sabres physical domination of the '99 Leafs than the Borchevsky '93 Leafs upset of the Wings. I was left wondering if the Ference elbow to Grabovski would be symbolic of this series.

I'm naturally hoping for the best (maybe a miracle) but to me, that game illustrated how tough it's going to be and sucked some of the hope out of me.

I'm with others about Saturday. The chances of this club coming back to win 4 out of 5 against this Bruins team seems extremely remote. Reimer needs to stand on his head or something to steal a win on Saturday.

I don't know ...i still don't think the leafs are anywhere near as bad as they played..if they were they wouldn't have as many wins as they do this year.  ...regression sure ..but not an absolute ..we don't know how to play hockey..and that's what last night was.  as Carlyle points out, he's never seen so many people fall with nobody around them. 

this looked 100% to me like a team playing nervous.  and I think it's valid.  this is a team with very little expierence not only with the playoffs, but winning in general.  I think that's also why they had some trouble at the end of the season.  they're not used to the extra surge of adrenaline that comes with being just on the cusp of something.  That's not something Boston has to worry about. 

Obviously game two will answer a lot more questions.  I for one am not the least bit surprised that the leafs lost the first game though. 

If they ever had a shot of making it to round two it definitely wasn't going to be a cakewalk. 

So I do think boston will be better than we saw, but on the other hand i think the leafs will be much much better.  is that enough?  hopefully

 

[Strangelove]

Stack a couple scoring lines, cut down Grabo's ice-time drastically (watching him getting ragdolled all over the place is tiresome) and maybe you'll at least be competitive out there.

Two things.

You can't cut down Grabovski's ice time because he was the best forward on the ice last night.

You also can't cut down Grabovski's ice time because Kadri cannot be trusted nor can he win face offs.

He worked hard but he still generated nothing, the same way he has all year.  And he was getting thrown around all over the place, the same way he has all year.  One PP in the third the Leafs had a three on one down low and Grabovski tried this ridiculous backhand thing rather than try to make a pass; the result was no shot on net.

I think people are reacting the way they are because Grabovski has been so awful for most of the year that even noticing him on the ice was surprising.  But he was not good, and relying on him to create offence against a big, strong team like Boston is a mistake, because he won't. You don't mess with your scoring lines going into the playoffs.

You also don't give Orr and McLaren nearly 10 mins of ice-time.

 

[Zee]

Ference being in or out is irrelevant to the outcome of the series.

Wasn't it 1-0 Leafs at the point of that illegal hit though?  Had a penalty been called as it should have been, who knows how the game would have turned out.  Sure it ended up lopsided, but you never know how the momentum goes if the call is made there.

I just checked the hit again.  It was 1-0 Leafs AND they were on the PP.  That would have been a 2-man advantage for about 50 seconds.

 

[Corn Flake]

You think Chara's going to be bothered by two 4th line fighters? Nope.  Every team in the league goes at him.

He looked very bothered by them in the first period.  Sure they don't strike fear but he was retaliating when they were running into him and stirring it up in the crease.  That's their job and guys of smaller stature are going to get crushed by Chara and his free high sticking pass he gets from refs. I'd rather he be beating on McLearen than Lupul.

We've been through this all year long.. you take away your tough guys and the ones on the other team will do their best to push your non-tough guys around.  You can't simply drop both guys from the lineup.  The B's are already intimidating the Leafs.. it would only get worse.

Beat them with speed? Absolutely, but how about the speed the ten forwards ahead of those two in the lineup already bring? One more isn't going suddenly change the entire fortune of the team.  Forget about last two spots on the 4th line - the Leafs couldn't get any speed going because of the B's defense.  If the first line can't get it, sure as hell the 4th line isn't going to even if Frattin or whoever is dressed.

 

[Corn Flake]

I don't know what O'Byrne did to lose his spot to Kostka. He shows up and goes +4 and 28 hits over 8 games while on the ice for only 2 even strength goals against. Liles has to play with a guy like that against a club like the Bruins. Maybe he's hurt? I don't understand it otherwise.

Agree big time on this. I was surprised O'Byrne wasn't in for the start of this series but he should get in now.  He should be there with Liles or Gardiner.  O'Byrne is actually quite calm with the puck under pressure - the #1-10 reasons the Leafs lost last night was a lack of that very thing.