Randy Carlyle/Leaf Coach thread
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bustaheims
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Frank E said:
3:19 of total PK ice time last season. He's not getting a ton this season either - averaging only 24 seconds per game.
Coco-puffs
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bustaheims said:
When Kostka and Holzer were in the lineup, he rarely saw PK time (except when a Defenseman was in the box, 5 min Majors, etc). With Liles and Gardiner now in the lineup, I expect him to get more minutes on the PK.
CupOneDay said:
Bingo. Collapsing on your net is the go to method for weak defensive teams. It's just desperation. The wingers are always out of position making it extremely easy for defencemen to hold the line. The only recourse the Leafs have is to dump it out and turn it over. The only time the Leafs really get to break out of their end is when the other team goes for a line change. Even then, their breakout relies on a crisp first pass, and they really only have 2 guys who can make it with any consistency. They need to close the gap between the forwards and the D. Making a long pass to a stationary target is pretty useless.
Strangelove
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I'm hoping someone lets Randy know this summer that protecting a lead does not mean collapsing into your own end and hoping the other team doesn't score. This team had persistent difficulties protecting two-goal leads this year, due in large part to his refusal to continue to play offensive guys (both on offense and defense) when a lead was in place. It's a hell of a lot harder for the other team to score--particularly a big, slow team like Boston--when they're playing in their own end and forced to outskate the likes of Kessel, Lupul and Kadri. And yet throughout the season and this past series in particular, Randy refused to see that.
That collapse could and should have been avoided
That collapse could and should have been avoided
Optimus Reimer
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Strangelove said:
I still think the players were still under the RW system and had very little time to adjust to RC's style. If we compare the physicality and toughness of this team compared to the teams under RW, the difference is day and night. I also believe youth and inexperience were factors in the 3rd period collapse - the experienced teams know how to protect a lead and know how to handle themselves in tough situations...all this was new to most of the Leaf players.
Let the players sit and think about this all summer. Let Carlyle and Nonis work together to add/subtract players to improve the team defensively and in the middle. Let the players adjust to RC's style which I believe is to be more agressive towards the puck carrier. If Carlyle and Nonis can make the right moves, this team will win at least 1 playoff series next year.
WhatIfGodWasALeaf
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Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate said:
We said the same last summer, no?
I'd actually like to see him replace Carlyle.
Stronger Than All
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I saw something funny on Facebook last night. A Penguins fan said "that's how you hold a 4-1 lead Leafs fans". A Leafs fan replied and said "why are you telling me? it's not like I play for the team. Please message Randy Carlyle." 
WhatIfGodWasALeaf said:Zanzibar Buck-Buck McFate said:
We said the same last summer, no?
I'd actually like to see him replace Carlyle.
His contract didn't allow him to leave last summer. Now he'll be free to entertain NHL offers.
moon111 said:
I'd be surprised if he wasn't the highest paid coach in the AHL right now. But I don't think money would be enough to keep him from advancing in his career.
proteus2000
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CarltonTheBear said:
No doubt he is the highest paid coach in the AHL. But I agree, when he is ready to be a head coach, he will jump at the opportunity. I think he signed for 3 yrs with the Marlies last June not only b/c his family lives here and it's comfortable, but also b/c there was also a chance Toronto would suck for a couple of years and he would get the position with the Leafs.
It would suck if he left but understandable.
moon111
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Between Phaneuf, Franson, Gardiner, Kessel, and Fraser...that's 62 giveaways in the playoffs. I'll give Carlyle some slack because of the messed up season, but he's got to get these guys thinking like Boston. Just because Phaneuf can make a play, doesn't mean he always should. Sadly, I don't think anyone or coach can tell him anything. Hopefully he learnt something in these playoffs, where his giveaway stat is an embarrassment. Maybe shame will lead him to change and Carlyle can get the rest of the team to follow.
L K
Active member
I guess for me a few things I have issue with on Carlyle:
1) Lineup decisions. I don't understand why you play both McLaren and Orr in the regular season all the time and then don't view them as playoff worthy. It doesn't make sense to me. Either they are worth being in the lineup, or they aren't. While playing younger guys 5 minutes a game isn't ideal, I think those minutes would have been far better spent on developing Frattin/Colborne down the stretch at the very least.
2) Timeouts. The Leafs get spooked when things start going south in the 3rd period. Rarely did I see Randy use timeouts. I recall this being a problem with Ron Wilson too. With Ron the Leafs would go on stretches of giving up 2-3 goals and he wouldn't call a timeout and you just knew when it was going to be a big outburst from the other team. I really wonder what a timeout might have done to calm the team down in the 3rd against Boston.
3) Sticking with the same thing over and over again. The PP at times in the postseason was brutal with Franson and Phaneuf on the top until. To me, a change might have made a difference. Dion was fighting the puck the whole series (injury or not, I'm not sure) but maybe something should have changed. It seemed like the PP either led to a Leafs goal or was a huge momentum boost for Boston. There was no in between.
4) Designing breakout plays. In the postseason Randy found a way to partially break Boston's stifling neutal zone system with the flip pass breakouts. It worked quite well. Where was that creativity on trying to design plays to get the puck out of the zone. The Leafs rarely used the boards and seem to have a big issue clearing the zone. Something should have been done to try and get that going a little better.
5) Faceoffs. I can't really blame him for the team not being good on them, especially in a shortened season where there isn't a lot of down-time to work on things like this, but the defensive system really should have been adjusted to handle the frequent faceoff losses. The point shots coming directly off faceoffs were a big problem.
I honestly don't know what the right decision would be. It seems strange to potentially go in another direction when Carlyle took a team that was questionable for the playoffs and managed to push Boston to OT of game 7, but the Leafs really should have won this series based on what happened on the ice.
Some of his roster decisions (benching Gardiner for Kostka/O'Byrne/Fraser/Holzer; benching Frattin, MacArthur, and Colborne for McLaren/Orr; etc) might have been the difference between 5th place and the division during the regular season.
1) Lineup decisions. I don't understand why you play both McLaren and Orr in the regular season all the time and then don't view them as playoff worthy. It doesn't make sense to me. Either they are worth being in the lineup, or they aren't. While playing younger guys 5 minutes a game isn't ideal, I think those minutes would have been far better spent on developing Frattin/Colborne down the stretch at the very least.
2) Timeouts. The Leafs get spooked when things start going south in the 3rd period. Rarely did I see Randy use timeouts. I recall this being a problem with Ron Wilson too. With Ron the Leafs would go on stretches of giving up 2-3 goals and he wouldn't call a timeout and you just knew when it was going to be a big outburst from the other team. I really wonder what a timeout might have done to calm the team down in the 3rd against Boston.
3) Sticking with the same thing over and over again. The PP at times in the postseason was brutal with Franson and Phaneuf on the top until. To me, a change might have made a difference. Dion was fighting the puck the whole series (injury or not, I'm not sure) but maybe something should have changed. It seemed like the PP either led to a Leafs goal or was a huge momentum boost for Boston. There was no in between.
4) Designing breakout plays. In the postseason Randy found a way to partially break Boston's stifling neutal zone system with the flip pass breakouts. It worked quite well. Where was that creativity on trying to design plays to get the puck out of the zone. The Leafs rarely used the boards and seem to have a big issue clearing the zone. Something should have been done to try and get that going a little better.
5) Faceoffs. I can't really blame him for the team not being good on them, especially in a shortened season where there isn't a lot of down-time to work on things like this, but the defensive system really should have been adjusted to handle the frequent faceoff losses. The point shots coming directly off faceoffs were a big problem.
I honestly don't know what the right decision would be. It seems strange to potentially go in another direction when Carlyle took a team that was questionable for the playoffs and managed to push Boston to OT of game 7, but the Leafs really should have won this series based on what happened on the ice.
Some of his roster decisions (benching Gardiner for Kostka/O'Byrne/Fraser/Holzer; benching Frattin, MacArthur, and Colborne for McLaren/Orr; etc) might have been the difference between 5th place and the division during the regular season.
Andy007
Active member
bbt said:
The thing is, Phaneuf is pretty useful when his minutes are limited. When Carlyle plays him like he's Chris Pronger, that's when Phaneuf's deficiencies are on full display.
And that, in addition to the points LK listed, is really what bugs me about Carlyle. There is a stubbornness for sure, but also a blindness when it comes to certain players. If Phaneuf is really battling the puck, not playing physical, getting beaten to loose pucks, etc. Carlyle just keeps on playing him top minutes. If Gardiner or Frattin make a mistake; however, their butts are on the pine (or in the pressbox). That really stuck out to me in the playoffs too. In game 7 Phaneuf was horrid, and most likely really hurt, and he barely left the ice. Liles, who I thought was great in that game- hardly seen near the end of the game. His minute allotment doesn't make a lot of sense.
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