Ryan O'Byrne To Toronto

[WhatIfGodWasALeaf]

Gunnarrson - Phaneuf
Liles - O'Byrne
Fraser - Franson
Gardiner
Kostka

That's what I(potentially) don't like about this. O'Byrne seems decent enough but I don't want Gardiner sitting for the rest of the year.

To be fair, I remember when Boston won the cup, Seguin was a healthy scratch for a good portion of it (he only came in due to injuries to Horton & Krecji).  I guess part of it is a learning experience for younger players...

Sure, and if the Leafs were the sort of contenders that the Bruins were that year I'd accept that they'd be making moves at the deadline to bolster their vets at maybe the expense of the PT of some of the younger guys in the service of making a deep playoff run.

If, however, the attitude going into the playoffs is that it's kind of a learning experience for the club as a whole I'd want Gardiner to be a part of that.

Most teams go through about 9 dmen through an average playoff run though, I suspect Gardiner will see plenty of ice.

 

[CoachKirill]

I seen Colorado few times this year, mostly against Van, Edmonton and Flames and he looked not bad at all. (however who doesn't look good against the Flames this year) - solid stay home D. Didn't cost us anything (4th 2014 is a reallyyy long term draft pick) and added a guy who if plays well can be resigned too. Also bring playoff experience we do not have at all.

 

[Bonsixx]

Gunnarrson - Phaneuf
Liles - O'Byrne
Fraser - Franson
Gardiner
Kostka

That's what I(potentially) don't like about this. O'Byrne seems decent enough but I don't want Gardiner sitting for the rest of the year.

To be fair, I remember when Boston won the cup, Seguin was a healthy scratch for a good portion of it (he only came in due to injuries to Horton & Krecji).  I guess part of it is a learning experience for younger players...

Sure, and if the Leafs were the sort of contenders that the Bruins were that year I'd accept that they'd be making moves at the deadline to bolster their vets at maybe the expense of the PT of some of the younger guys in the service of making a deep playoff run.

If, however, the attitude going into the playoffs is that it's kind of a learning experience for the club as a whole I'd want Gardiner to be a part of that.

Whatever helps the team do well, is the best thing for Gardiner's development.

Don't get me wrong, I hope he plays too, and I think he probably will, but it just might not be every game.

 

[Corn Flake]

Gunnarrson - Phaneuf
Liles - O'Byrne
Fraser - Franson
Gardiner
Kostka

That's what I(potentially) don't like about this. O'Byrne seems decent enough but I don't want Gardiner sitting for the rest of the year.

Thing is, Gardiner plays the left side and O'Byne plays the right.  Leafs needed a right side d-man in a big way and Gardiner wasn't going to be moved to his off-side to make things even more challenging for him in his zone.

Carlyle tried Liles on the right with Gardiner and that failed.  This might actually give Gardiner a chance to play with a stay-at-home guy vs. Liles who is also a gambler.

As well, I think the Liles/Gardiner/O'Byrne unit is the 3rd pairing, not the 2nd.  Takes even more heat off.

 

[Kin]

Whatever helps the team do well, is the best thing for Gardiner's development.

I just don't think that's true if it involves him not playing.

 

[nutman]

So all we picked up was a stay at home dman, now where have I been hearing that all week. hmmmm....  8)

 

[Kin]

This might actually give Gardiner a chance to play with a stay-at-home guy vs. Liles who is also a gambler.

As well, I think the Liles/Gardiner/O'Byrne unit is the 3rd pairing, not the 2nd.  Takes even more heat off.

All of that, I'd be right on board with. In fact the idea of getting a responsible stay at home guy to handcuff to Gardiner makes all the sense in the world to me.

 

[crowlster]

I'd rather see:

O'Byrne - Phaneuf
Liles - Gardiner/Gunnarson
Fraser - Franson

Would prefer to see Gunnarson as a healthy scratch, really not seeing anything out of him this season. Maybe i just keep missing all his good plays, but i seem to always see his giveaways.
Seeing as O'Byrne is a stay at home defenceman, it may allow Phaneuf to be a bit more free to be offensive. 

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

No O'Byrne on top pairing, no no no.

 

[gilmourthegreat]

Whatever helps the team do well, is the best thing for Gardiner's development.

I just don't think that's true if it involves him not playing.

A huge part of Gardiner's development going forward is going to be mental. Part of that development may include him realizing he's not good enough yet to play top-six minutes in the playoffs. If he isn't, he will need to make the necessary adjustments to his preparation.

If Gardiner can't make an NHL-average top-six, the solution isn't to water down his competition, it's to make him realize he has to work harder. Part of that solution can involve raising the competitive bar.

Gardiner has the physical tools to be absolutely dominant, at this point for him it's about learning to harness those tools properly.

 

[Kin]

A huge part of Gardiner's development going forward is going to be mental. Part of that development may include him realizing he's not good enough yet to play top-six minutes in the playoffs. If he isn't, he will need to make the necessary adjustments to his preparation.

If Gardiner can't make an NHL-average top-six, the solution isn't to water down his competition, it's to make him realize he has to work harder. Part of that solution can involve raising the competitive bar.

Gardiner has the physical tools to be absolutely dominant, at this point for him it's about learning to harness those tools properly.

I don't necessarily disagree with any of that. I just don't think it can be done from the press box. If the argument was playing him in the NHL vs. the AHL then sure but I don't think there's much, if any, benefit to sitting a guy in the press box for a significant chunk of the year even if he weren't good enough to be playing which, personally, I don't think has been the case with Gardiner.

 

[Corn Flake]

This might actually give Gardiner a chance to play with a stay-at-home guy vs. Liles who is also a gambler.

As well, I think the Liles/Gardiner/O'Byrne unit is the 3rd pairing, not the 2nd.  Takes even more heat off.

All of that, I'd be right on board with. In fact the idea of getting a responsible stay at home guy to handcuff to Gardiner makes all the sense in the world to me.

I really believe that's the plan here.  Gardiner's battle is with Liles for ice time, not anyone else, IMO.  Carlyle needed a stay at home guy to anchor that pairing for it to work. It wasn't going to work as constructed.  This gives it a chance.

edit: this should put Kostka in the press box for good, and move Liles back to the left where it's safer.

 

[OldTimeHockey]

This might actually give Gardiner a chance to play with a stay-at-home guy vs. Liles who is also a gambler.

As well, I think the Liles/Gardiner/O'Byrne unit is the 3rd pairing, not the 2nd.  Takes even more heat off.

All of that, I'd be right on board with. In fact the idea of getting a responsible stay at home guy to handcuff to Gardiner makes all the sense in the world to me.

I'm not 100% sure that Gardiner would be the guy that O'Byrne would replace.


As for Jake, I think you'll be seeing him in and out of the line up for the remainder of this season. People will call it a coaches vendetta or whatever. It couldn't be further from that IMO. Gardiner is still making way too many mistakes and it needs to be corrected.

There's a learning curve. One that we all thought he had gone through last year. His last 5 games showed the opposite.

 

[Kin]

I really believe that's the plan here.  Gardiner's battle is with Liles for ice time, not anyone else, IMO.  Carlyle needed a stay at home guy to anchor that pairing for it to work. It wasn't going to work as constructed.  This gives it a chance.

Sure. Like I said, my potential concern here is that the short-term benefits(if they exist) of playing Liles outweighs the long term sense of playing Gardiner.

 

[Kin]

I'm not 100% sure that Gardiner would be the guy that O'Byrne would replace.

Me either. That's why I've done my best to put this all in the hypothetical.

 

[caver]

This might actually give Gardiner a chance to play with a stay-at-home guy vs. Liles who is also a gambler.

As well, I think the Liles/Gardiner/O'Byrne unit is the 3rd pairing, not the 2nd.  Takes even more heat off.

All of that, I'd be right on board with. In fact the idea of getting a responsible stay at home guy to handcuff to Gardiner makes all the sense in the world to me.

I really believe that's the plan here.  Gardiner's battle is with Liles for ice time, not anyone else, IMO.  Carlyle needed a stay at home guy to anchor that pairing for it to work. It wasn't going to work as constructed.  This gives it a chance.

edit: this should put Kostka in the press box for good, and move Liles back to the left where it's safer.

Bingo !

 

[OldTimeHockey]

I'm not 100% sure that Gardiner would be the guy that O'Byrne would replace.

Me either. That's why I've done my best to put this all in the hypothetical.

Jeez, put some clouds or some fog if you're going to get all hypothetical.

 

[Kessel Run]

Good move. The depth is a good thing. I'm fine with this being the only move.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

We get badly outshot because we're a poor possession team, so I don't know how adding the worst possession player on the worst team helps the Leafs in any way.  Gardiner is probably just as good defensively at this point.

 

[CoachKirill]

I'd rather see:

O'Byrne - Phaneuf
Liles - Gardiner/Gunnarson
Fraser - Franson

Would prefer to see Gunnarson as a healthy scratch, really not seeing anything out of him this season. Maybe i just keep missing all his good plays, but i seem to always see his giveaways.
Seeing as O'Byrne is a stay at home defenceman, it may allow Phaneuf to be a bit more free to be offensive.

O'Byrne is not a first pairing guy. Gunnar is a better player than him