maplesyrup
New member
bustaheims said:
Well, it would certainly make an impact on the use of the word which is what I'm talking about here. Honestly, I really pity the person who doesn't see how it's a slur.
The Official Complaint Thread!
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Well, it would certainly make an impact on the use of the word which is what I'm talking about here. Honestly, I really pity the person who doesn't see how it's a slur.
maplesyrup
New member
Tigger said:
They'd be equally offensive if "kick a red-head day" actually existed... and good thing you're not a kid anymore then I guess.
Kin
New member
hap_leaf said:
Right. Nobody is saying that's ok. The issue is whether or not specific words make that action worse or if the word, entirely divorced from the actions, is in and of itself worthy of punishment. Kids have lots of words to use to make other kids feel bad that can be based on anything or based on nothing. The distinction being made is between the words and the actions.
bustaheims
Active member
hap_leaf said:
When you ban a word, you're not punishing the perpetrator for their actions. If a kid is bullying another kid with the word ginger, then, absolutely, punish the kid for that action - and that action is bullying, regardless of the words that were used. If that kid can't say ginger, they'll find something else they can say, because it's not about the words they're using but, like you said, trying to invoke a response and gain a feeling of superiority. Banning the word is separating the actions from the perpetrator. It's reacting to the effect rather than the cause.
maplesyrup
New member
Nik? said:
No. I don't think I am. A slur is a slur and "ginger" alienates an entire genetic lineage.
bustaheims
Active member
SGT said:
But, it still doesn't deal with the actual problem, which is bullying.
And, honestly, as a slur, ginger is, at worst, on par with calling an African black or a calling Jewish person a Jew. It's only a slur if there is hatred behind it, otherwise, it's just a descriptor.
maplesyrup
New member
bustaheims said:
... and it usually isn't used any other way unless we're talkin' food here.
bustaheims
Active member
SGT said:
That's just completely untrue. To me and just about everyone I know, a ginger is just a person with specific external features. Like with the term black, only a small segment of small minded people use it as a slur.
Kin
New member
SGT said:
It doesn't represent hundreds of years of oppression, murder and dehumanization. It isn't the basis for legally entrenched systemic discrimination or prejudice. It has no connection to some of the most monstrous acts in human history. That is what you are comparing it to. You are comparing it to words that represented an attitude that it was alright to buy and sell other people as property. To rape and murder them and treat them as farm animals. That is what the particular ethnic slur you've chosen to equate "ginger" to means.
Not hurt feelings on a playground. Not something being used in place of hundreds of other stupid things a kid can say. Not something that, as this thread has shown, isn't even universally agreed upon as to whether or not it's particularly offensive amongst the people being "slurred".
Get a hold of yourself here.
SGT said:
Why, because I'd be thinking for myself and challenging the notion that the word itself is bad rather than the bullying that started it? In fact I'd start a 'kick a Burnsy day' just to get the point across and have them try to ban auburn, red head and ginger.
Heck, I'd try to get chromosome 16 banned while I was at it, just to show how ridiculous it is.
Ginger has been used to describe red hair for a long, long time. I can certainly understand not wanting to be bullied or experience hatred because of your hair colour but that has nothing to do with the word itself.
I mean, what, using 'ginger' is going to make MIA's video come true?
maplesyrup
New member
Nik? said:
Well, if you cares to actually read the thread you'll see the post where I said "fine" it was a slur more like something else... I don't think I'm the one in need of holding here.
Kin
New member
SGT said:
I did read that. Then I read after, in reply #897, you again ludicrously equating ginger to the N-Word which prompted my response.
Seriously. You could be making a legitimate point here about the need to curb bullying but instead you've decided to take a position that is ridiculous on it's face. It doesn't matter why a kid is getting bullied. Efforts should be taken to stop it. Kids using a word that many people, as evidenced by this thread, view as benign to bully someone else does not make that word the equivalent of racial slurs. You are embarrassing yourself by saying otherwise.
In casual conversation, I've never experienced "Ginger" as a socially acceptable term. Never had anyone ask me to kindly take a beer over to "the Ginger" or asked "Have you seen a Ginger come by recently?". And I think this is because people are unsure of its place in society.
I've only experienced this as a semi-derogatory term, the source of funny websites about "gingervitis" (and the South Park episode). So I can see why someone with red hair would find it awkward. Should they have the final say if it is offensive or not?
I've only experienced this as a semi-derogatory term, the source of funny websites about "gingervitis" (and the South Park episode). So I can see why someone with red hair would find it awkward. Should they have the final say if it is offensive or not?
maplesyrup
New member
Nik? said:
I don't like the slur. It's in poor taste and the level to which it might be compared to is up for debate. Seriously, how can I be embarrassing myself when I believe I'm right?
maplesyrup
New member
hap_leaf said:
Yes, absolutely.
Kin
New member
SGT said:
Sure it's up for debate. As we've seen in this thread, people are more than comfortable debating whether or not it's offensive at all. Do you think the same would be true with any racial slurs? In particular the one you won't even type because of how offensive it is? Think there's anyone who's going to chime in with "Yeah, you know, I've always thought of using the N-word to describe black people as kind of benign".
SGT said:
Because embarrassing yourself doesn't necessarily refer to how you view yourself or the actions you're taking.
bustaheims
Active member
hap_leaf said:
Sure, but, as we've seen evidenced by this thread and by many of us in our day to day lives, even redheads as a group can't agree on whether it's offensive or not, with the majority seemingly leaning towards not.