The Unofficial Fire Ron Wilson/Ron Wilson is the Greatest Thread

[Rebel_1812]

wilson seems more cheerful with the media this year.  Maybe its because he has a better team.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

wilson seems more cheerful with the media this year.  Maybe its because he has a better team.

Maybe he and Burke have already signed the extension, but haven't told the media yet.

 

[Tigger]

A good cop kind of assistant for sure.

Yeah and maybe more if he has any kind of bloom...

 

[Fanatic]

Fight!

Nah... I just changed back to my old boring name.

 

[Corn Flake]

I think the players are decent enough that the team should be competing for a playoff spot and be in the playoffs this season.  But there are two problems:  the Leafs PP and the Leafs willingness to play pond hockey. 

Game 1:  The Canadiens were snake bitten a bit.  They should have had at least 3 or 4 goals if it was not for some bad luck for them. 

Game 2:  Leafs trail the Flames by 2 in the first 7 minutes of the game and had to play hard to pull out the win.

Game 3:  Leafs nearly blew a big lead against the sens.

Game 4:  Leafs fell behind to the Avalanche and had to play hard to tie it.  In the process, there were considerable goof ups in their defensive zone that if Colorado had capitalized on, would have easily won the game.

Unless the PP improves and Wilson gets the team to improve their breakouts, I don't expect the Leafs to make the playoffs, and so far under Wilson, the Leafs have been horrible in their defensive end and on the PP.

And watch now.  Other teams who saw the Leafs play last night will realize the way to beat the Leafs is to forecheck hard and keep them boxed in their own end.

Anyone watching the first four games of baseball would probably conclude that the Yankees won't make the post-season based solely on play.

Anyone seen the Cup champs play yet?  Deeezzzaaasssterrrrr.

 

[BlueWhiteBlood]

Anyone seen the Cup champs play yet?  Deeezzzaaasssterrrrr.

They certainly were against Carolina, wow! The refs simply had with them and started turfing all of them who even remotely crossed the line. I don't think they took to kindly to being verbally abused by Chara at all.

 

[Corn Flake]

Anyone seen the Cup champs play yet?  Deeezzzaaasssterrrrr.

They certainly were against Carolina, wow! The refs simply had with them and started turfing all of them who even remotely crossed the line. I don't think they took to kindly to being verbally abused by Chara at all.

For sure. They have looked very disjointed in games prior to that debacle last night.  This isn't just cup hangover/tired stuff.. this is a team that looks disorganized and not at all like one with systems established and of cup winning caliber.

I haven't seen the Caps or the Wings play yet but from what I hear they look in mid-season form, as did the Avs the other night. Most teams are generally working out 500 kinks and getting systems settled in at this time of the year.  The Leafs are no different than most, and luckily they are winning more than they are losing.

 

[hockeyfan1]

Unless the PP improves and Wilson gets the team to improve their breakouts, I don't expect the Leafs to make the playoffs, and so far under Wilson, the Leafs have been horrible in their defensive
end and on the PP.
 

For the record, the Leafs rank 22nd out of 30 on the pp pct.

Statistal source:  ESPN

 

[maplesyrup]

I've said this before bit I feel it worth mentioning again... I argue the PK was the primary reason we missed the playoffs last year. Moreover, Boston proved you can be a cup champion with a great PK and virtually no PP. Would I like an improvement to out PP? Sure... but as long as our PK is acceptable, I'll give Wilson a bit of a break on the PP.

 

[ZBBM]

I've said this before bit I feel it worth mentioning again... I argue the PK was the primary reason we missed the playoffs last year. Moreover, Boston proved you can be a cup champion with a great PK and virtually no PP. Would I like an improvement to out PP? Sure... but as long as our PK is acceptable, I'll give Wilson a bit of a break on the PP.

I too think it's possible to get into the dance with a topflight PK and bad PP, but it's wickedly hard, and you have to play a defense-first/trap style to make it work.  I don't like that style myself, so I want to see at least mediocrity out of the PP.  That's a bar that even Wilson should be able to reach, although he hasn't yet.

 

[maplesyrup]

I've said this before bit I feel it worth mentioning again... I argue the PK was the primary reason we missed the playoffs last year. Moreover, Boston proved you can be a cup champion with a great PK and virtually no PP. Would I like an improvement to out PP? Sure... but as long as our PK is acceptable, I'll give Wilson a bit of a break on the PP.

I too think it's possible to get into the dance with a topflight PK and bad PP, but it's wickedly hard, and you have to play a defense-first/trap style to make it work.  I don't like that style myself, so I want to see at least mediocrity out of the PP.  That's a bar that even Wilson should be able to reach, although he hasn't yet.

For sure. I'm by no means justifying a putrid PP (which we have now)... I'm just saying that I'm less concerned with the PP than I am with the PK.

 

[Optimus Reimer]

And watch now.  Other teams who saw the Leafs play last night will realize the way to beat the Leafs is to forecheck hard and keep them boxed in their own end.

That's like a Bechamel or Veloute hockey sauce, it applies to pretty much every team.

The PP isn't clicking, that's obvious right now but the pk has improved. If the Leafs can manage to really improve the pk over the long haul I'm honestly not nearly as worried about the PP. It would be nice to see both improve and I think in time they will but with decent es scoring and a top 12-ish pk I think they have a shot at the playoffs.

Improve the PP all you want, it will not matter.  The good teams are able to handle hard forechecking, and I do not see the Leafs as being that type of team.  It isn't that the players are not good, because I believe that this is a team that should be in the playoffs or at least competing for a playoff spot by the end of the season.  I believe it has to do with Wilson's playing system, and that is what concerns me.  It is like they need a road map to try to get out of their own end.

 

[Marbo]

The extra bodies on the team give Wilson the flexibility to bench the underachivers. Schenn was playing below average since the season started, he was nailed on the bench was whole 3rd period tonight. Although I feel sorry to see him sit but this is definitely what Leafs fans want to see. Players need to earn their minutes, B.B. and the management team are doing a great job on keeping extra bodies around to create competition. This end up making a better and more competitive team which is lacking for the past so many years! Go Leafs Go!

 

[Tigger]

And watch now.  Other teams who saw the Leafs play last night will realize the way to beat the Leafs is to forecheck hard and keep them boxed in their own end.

That's like a Bechamel or Veloute hockey sauce, it applies to pretty much every team.

The PP isn't clicking, that's obvious right now but the pk has improved. If the Leafs can manage to really improve the pk over the long haul I'm honestly not nearly as worried about the PP. It would be nice to see both improve and I think in time they will but with decent es scoring and a top 12-ish pk I think they have a shot at the playoffs.

Improve the PP all you want, it will not matter.  The good teams are able to handle hard forechecking, and I do not see the Leafs as being that type of team.  It isn't that the players are not good, because I believe that this is a team that should be in the playoffs or at least competing for a playoff spot by the end of the season.  I believe it has to do with Wilson's playing system, and that is what concerns me.  It is like they need a road map to try to get out of their own end.

Wilsons system is why the Leafs won't be able to handle hard forechecking teams? That doesn't entirely compute.

I don't agree that the Leafs aren't able to handle a hard forecheck either, they may need to get better but so far they don't entirely suck at it. Like I said it's a staple of hockey and most any team can succumb to it on any given night.

 

[Optimus Reimer]

And watch now.  Other teams who saw the Leafs play last night will realize the way to beat the Leafs is to forecheck hard and keep them boxed in their own end.

That's like a Bechamel or Veloute hockey sauce, it applies to pretty much every team.

The PP isn't clicking, that's obvious right now but the pk has improved. If the Leafs can manage to really improve the pk over the long haul I'm honestly not nearly as worried about the PP. It would be nice to see both improve and I think in time they will but with decent es scoring and a top 12-ish pk I think they have a shot at the playoffs.

Improve the PP all you want, it will not matter.  The good teams are able to handle hard forechecking, and I do not see the Leafs as being that type of team.  It isn't that the players are not good, because I believe that this is a team that should be in the playoffs or at least competing for a playoff spot by the end of the season.  I believe it has to do with Wilson's playing system, and that is what concerns me.  It is like they need a road map to try to get out of their own end.

Wilsons system is why the Leafs won't be able to handle hard forechecking teams? That doesn't entirely compute.

I don't agree that the Leafs aren't able to handle a hard forecheck either, they may need to get better but so far they don't entirely suck at it. Like I said it's a staple of hockey and most any team can succumb to it on any given night.

Against the Jets, Avalanche and Canadiens, the Leafs had long stretches when they had problems getting out of their zone.  Bad passes, turnovers, or they decide to stand still or take a stupid penalty.  Reimer then has to bail them out. 

True, every team can succumb to that on any given night, but they cannot continue to play like that because it will eventually catch up to them.  We'll see how the team is doing after 20 games.   

 

[Tigger]

Against the Jets, Avalanche and Canadiens, the Leafs had long stretches when they had problems getting out of their zone.  Bad passes, turnovers, or they decide to stand still or take a stupid penalty.  Reimer then has to bail them out.

Are those teams really known as 'hard forechecking' teams? Didn't seem that way entirely to me.

I'd like to see an 'unforced error' stat at NHL.com.

We'll see how the team is doing after 20 games. 

I agree, let's see at least a quarter of the season then really get gritty about what the Leafs should do to build the team in response, really hard to say so far.

 

[avatarx51]

Ron Wilson,

why not just go with Reimer in last nights game? why not go with the hotter hand? and the team plays much better in front of Reimer, and your playing the stanley cup champs why you putting in your backup??

They are setting up the monster for a loss and eventual demotion.

 

[maplesyrup]

Ron Wilson,

why not just go with Reimer in last nights game? why not go with the hotter hand? and the team plays much better in front of Reimer, and your playing the stanley cup champs why you putting in your backup??

They are setting up the monster for a loss and eventual demotion.

You have to rest your #1 some time. Last night was a perfect situation to do so. It wasn't a "set up."

 

[Optimus Reimer]

Against the Jets, Avalanche and Canadiens, the Leafs had long stretches when they had problems getting out of their zone.  Bad passes, turnovers, or they decide to stand still or take a stupid penalty.  Reimer then has to bail them out.

Are those teams really known as 'hard forechecking' teams? Didn't seem that way entirely to me.

I'd like to see an 'unforced error' stat at NHL.com.

No, those teams are not hard forechecking teams, but they made life hard for the Leafs, and the Leafs could have easily lost those 3 games.  I'll take the wins any way they come, but I am concerned with their defensive system, or lack of one. 

We'll see how the team is doing after 20 games. 

I agree, let's see at least a quarter of the season then really get gritty about what the Leafs should do to build the team in response, really hard to say so far.

 

[cw]

I've had my share of criticism of Ron Wilson over the past three seasons. I never reached the point of hating the guy or anything that bad though I did reach the point that I would have tried another coach.

As statement of the obvious, he continues to struggle with specials teams. Although they've had a weak schedule and the special teams have struggled some (particularly the PK), I think credit is due that he won games they should have or need to win so far to give them a decent  shot at the playoffs.

More specifically, credit is due in a variety of coaching areas including:
- giving kids like Frattin & Gardiner a chance based upon merit rather than the easy reliance on vets
- being a little quicker to knock someone down a notch if they're not performing up to expectations or someone else is performing better
- being willing to sit the enforcers
- various nuances on the PP that haven't clicked yet but are being tried - both in personnel  & systems (ie in gaining the zone and what they've been doing within the zone)
- the way he's employed of specialty talents like Steckel and managed his lines/pairings (overall - I have some specific complaints for another time)
- etc

Ron knows his neck is in a noose so I'm sure that's part of it. He's coaching like there's no tomorrow because for him, there isn't. Folks have noted some errors but overall, I think to date this season is his best performance in Toronto so far. I don't say that just because of his record though obviously, it has something significant to do with it. I've noted a number of things he's done to help them get that record - it's not just the skaters who deserve credit for this start.