Depression and Anxiety

[Wendel's Fist]

My mixed feelings are that my family doc and psychiatrist suggest I may never be healthy enough to work again...

I'm not really qualified to speak against your doctors, but I find that a ridiculous statement. Don't take this the wrong way, but your physical health is really not good. Obviously, you know that by way of your excellent blog (150reasons.com -- go read it everybody!) So until your physical health is improved, you one convince me one bit that your mental health is uncurable.

They go hand-in-hand!

You may have to always take medication and you may not be able to have a full-time job, but I can almost guarantee that your mental health will improve with your physical health. Everybody I know (not many, admittedly) that has made major changes to their nutrition and exercise has admitted to feeling happier and more fulfilled.

It's clear that your wife supports you and your children love you; there's a reason for that.

Keep up the good work!

Well, Rick's dealing with more than depression though. Being physically fit doesn't do a thing for anxiety. I had my first panic attack when I was 11 and was involved in every sport you can think of. The most fit that I ever was in my life after that was in my early 20's and that's the only time that I was agoraphobic.

Shayne Corson first had panic attacks while playing with the Leafs and he was in great shape. Better than the average person, for sure.

I'm not disagreeing with what you're saying totally. We're not talking about the Leafs here, damn it. 

There's no doubt that getting in shape helps with depression and I totally agree with what you said about Rick's doctors saying that he may never work again.

Rick, if you're reading this.............if a doctor or therapist that you're seeing tells you that you might not be able to work again then switch to someone else.

This year is 30 years since I had my first panic attack and a therapist once told me the same thing a long time ago. I've had businesses and worked for others since.

If a therapist or doctor can't give you hope, what the hell good are they? They can sometimes be more of a problem than the problem itself.

 

[sucka]

Wow that's a great blog, Rick.  I hope your progress with your weight loss is something you can focus and latch onto.  Keep it up, ima keep checking now that i know u have that blog.  Isn't it dangerous to drink all thAt water? Would your salt/ electrolyte? levels go too low?  I guess a baconator will fix that!  Man I wish they would bring back the spicy baconator, even petitioned their cdn headoffice. Ugh 3am no sleep again and now I'm jonsing for a burger.

 

[moon111]

I recently followed Theo Fleury via Twitter.  One of his followers had a picture I couldn't figure out what it was.  That plus the bizarre nick and comments raised my curiosity enough to check out her profile.  The picture were cuts.  Other pictures included other self-inflicted cutting and bruises.  I felt obligated to try and give some positive words of encouragement.  She had been abused...since the age of 5.  Many times the positive comments given by me and others were met with bitter, hateful replies.  Most just gave up.  A few guys were feeding her insulting, derogatory comments.  Found out there was a suicide pact involved.  It's pretty hard to have a real conversation via Twitter.  Much I don't know.  And honestly I don't know if this is even a real person, but when I saw the last profile picture of a simple note stating, "I'm Sorry" my heart sank.  The account shortly after was closed.

I don't judge, but hopefully my view point was taken into consideration.  Sometimes we're in a dark place in our lives.  But like the last comment in one of my favorite songs, "It's Amazing", by Aerosmith, "The light at the end of the tunnel may be you."  http://youtu.be/zSmOvYzSeaQ

 

[Stebro]

I don't really trust the healthcare in general to be honest. I mean there are so many things related to depression that are just plain weird. They act as if all depressions are related to chemical imbalances, which they never prove. Then they take risks by giving people medication without having proof. They're just toying around too much imo. And it's already a fact that all depressions don't depend on these chemicals.

I think that in general depressions are the body's way of saying no. And as long as your mind don't adjust to what the body wants, it will keep on shutting down. I think that in general it's a matter of identity. So many people have things wrong imo, I do to, but im too stupid to change. I care too much about what other people think and status etc. I hate to admit it, but I do. I want a qualified nice job, with nice pay. But is that really the most important thing for me? No. It's important for me to show others that im not a complete screwup. Which is the problem I let my life be guided by what I think that other people will think of me. I think this is just as common as it is sad. Right now I keep on trying to manipulate myself that the type of work im looking for is right for me. Although deep down inside, I know that it isn't. And I keep on taking jobs that I don't really want at all. Because they reduce me as a human being, I'm just like a part of a computer or something.

 

[sucka]

And I keep on taking jobs that I don't really want at all. Because they reduce me as a human being, I'm just like a part of a computer or something.

I dunno if this is any consolation, but most people are probably bummed out by their jobs.  I think it's just a matter of how you look at it.  Yes you might be an insignificant cog and feel your talents are wasted, but just view it as a means to achieve your other goals.  Your job doesn't have to define your life or who you are as a person.  Meaningful work is not always easy to come across, especially in this day and age where we all have to specialize in something or another and becuase of efficiency and volume, they dictate that jobs and skills required are defined rather narrowly.  And plenty of times what was once an exciting position over time turns monotonous anyways.  Some of the happiest times in my early working life were those which you'd probably define as crappy, low paying, menial, soul sucking jobs.  Sometimes you just need to be thankful for what you do have and move on with life.  I get into tons of cabs where the drivers had 'respectable' jobs back home.  Alot of them aren't bitter about it, they're quite thankful that their family is in a better place, and i really respect them for that.

 

[moon111]

We trade our jobs and natural resources away for cheap merchandise.  North American workers are becoming an insignificant cog in a machine to make the rich richer.  The quality of our lives is going to go down, never mind incomes.  CAT, makers of heavy equipment, told workers to cut their wages in half because they can.  It's too bad we can't focus government on making people happy rather then make the rich richer.

 

[Bullfrog]

...
I think that in general depressions are the body's way of saying no. And as long as your mind don't adjust to what the body wants, it will keep on shutting down. I think that in general it's a matter of identity. So many people have things wrong imo, I do to, but im too stupid to change. I care too much about what other people think and status etc. I hate to admit it, but I do. ...

I agree very much with your first statement. Depression and many other illnesses are our body's way of saying no. Some of us know what it's saying no too, some of us don't because it's so repressed and hidden.

I don't think you're too stupid; your own comments show your awareness. I think you lack courage. I don't mean that in a mean way; I'm very much the same. I could have so much more in life, including happiness and health, but I lack the courage too. For the most part, i'm fortunate that I know why. I just haven't learned yet how to get the courage to make the changes and take the risks that I need.

 

[Bender]

And I keep on taking jobs that I don't really want at all. Because they reduce me as a human being, I'm just like a part of a computer or something.

I dunno if this is any consolation, but most people are probably bummed out by their jobs.  I think it's just a matter of how you look at it.  Yes you might be an insignificant cog and feel your talents are wasted, but just view it as a means to achieve your other goals.  Your job doesn't have to define your life or who you are as a person.  Meaningful work is not always easy to come across, especially in this day and age where we all have to specialize in something or another and becuase of efficiency and volume, they dictate that jobs and skills required are defined rather narrowly.  And plenty of times what was once an exciting position over time turns monotonous anyways.  Some of the happiest times in my early working life were those which you'd probably define as crappy, low paying, menial, soul sucking jobs.  Sometimes you just need to be thankful for what you do have and move on with life.  I get into tons of cabs where the drivers had 'respectable' jobs back home.  Alot of them aren't bitter about it, they're quite thankful that their family is in a better place, and i really respect them for that.

Yeah, I mean I have a friend from work who's family is well to do in Saudi Arabia. They could live like millionaires, they had servants and everything. Their house was free and there was no taxes, but the family gave it up to come to Canada. His job prospects are decent, but not AMAZING, but he would still rather make a whole lot less and live in this kind of lifestyle than back in Saudi Arabia.


Stebro, I'm slightly unsure of your predicament. Are there just no jobs out there that you like? What do you want and what are some strategies you can do to help achieve it? I'd much rather try and fail than not try and wonder what if.

 

[Corn Flake]

Some ideas for those doing a job they hate and want out ..... sorry for blabbering on end.. hopefully it helps someone out a bit...

1.5 years ago I started out on a plan to get myself out of a day job I couldn't stand, and do the things I really really wanted to do with my life. My day job made me miserable. I hated it and felt sick to my stomach the thought of having to do it for another 25-30 years before I could retire.  I wanted to get into real estate investing as something I could do to make money and "be my own boss".  The hope would be that it generated enough money that I could pursue a few other things I've wanted to do for a long time.

What I quickly realized, as most do, that it was going to be impossible to jump from the current job to my "dream job" in one step, without telling my family we were going to sell everything and live in a one-bedroom shack in the worst part of town for a few years. Its easy to give up right there, and for years I did, but what I finally sorted out was the steps I had to take between where I was now and where I wanted to be.

So two summers ago I quit full time and went to contract work, which in my industry pays a lot more as long as you can keep steady work going.  So far so good.  The keys were to 1: stay employed and 2: make as much money as possible doing what I hated to do (but do it well enough to get some pretty solid contracts) and save as much as possible to get to the next steps.  After that, long story short we bought and completed our first flip house this year and its on the market now. If all goes well I will continue to do this until I can drop the contract jobs and focus on real estate, and eventually get some of those hobbies going again.

I think whether or not you have the advantage of doing what I did (going contract) you need to figure out the steps in between where you are now and where you want to be, and recognize they take some risk, time and sacrifice to get there.  I'm not there yet, but I'm on my way.  Happier than ever about it too.

 

[Rick C.]

...One of his followers had a picture I couldn't figure out what it was.  That plus the bizarre nick and comments raised my curiosity enough to check out her profile.  The picture were cuts.  Other pictures included other self-inflicted cutting and bruises.

That's a 5" cut on my left arm, on a night this past summer when I felt overwhelmingly like I wanted to kill myself.  Instead, to fight it I cut myself - that pain lessened the suicidal thoughts.  Oh, I have 4 other smaller cuts from other times, as well...

 

[Tigger]

Oh, dude, man...

I've only known one other person who has done this and she's fine now but it's still kind of shocking.

If it means anything, I'm very happy you're here with us now.

 

[Rick C.]

Oh, dude, man...

I've only known one other person who has done this and she's fine now but it's still kind of shocking.

If it means anything, I'm very happy you're here with us now.

Yup, there's some pretty compelling reasons why I spent over 60 days in hospital since May - I think it was 5 different times I was admitted.

During one stay, they talked me into doing electric shock therapy (ECT it's called) on my poor old grey matter.  After 5 sessions, it wasn't working...

Depression, anxiety, and agoraphobia suck bigtime.  I'm a walking zombie on the amount of medications I take daily...

 

[lc9]

Rick, sorry if you answered these questions, but I haven't had time to read through the whole thread.  Have they prescribed a medicine for you that targets the glutamate neurotransmitters?  Most AD drugs primarily target dopamine or serotonin transmitters.  This isn't a common practice, which is why I am curious.  A drug like scopolamine, which is used for motion sickness, has shown to be effective in reducing depression in short period of time.  Also there is a growing field of study that suggests Ketamine, known as the street drug special K, has instant effects on severe depression.  They have tested this on severe cases, with many reports of the "fog" being gone in hours.

These treatments are uncommon because it hasn't been studied that well yet.  But early research indicates that the glutamate receptors, when acted upon, engage the body much more rapidly then other neurotransmitters.  Think of it if you had a leaky faucet.  Taking SSRIs or dopamine supplements would be like shutting off the water at the water plant...it is going to take a little while for the water to stop (or for the drug to work), where as the glutamate area of the brain would be like fixing the faucet head on the sink and stopping the leak immediately. 

I hope this helps anyone out there suffering from depression or anxiety, it is a bitch to deal with.

 

[Rick C.]

Have they prescribed a medicine for you that targets the glutamate neurotransmitters? 

No, I don't believe they have.  I have a meeting today with my mental health social worker and I'll see what he thinks.

For those that don't know me - I think everyone on this site that has met me would I agree that I'm just a normal, university educated, married father who had a good career and ran this site on the side for Leafs fans to hang out.  I'm not some maniacal axe-murder.  I've been hit very, very hard by this long episode of mental health - enough to disable me for at least the time being...  But I'm still the same old me otherwise...

 

[lc9]

Have they prescribed a medicine for you that targets the glutamate neurotransmitters? 

No, I don't believe they have.  I have a meeting today with my mental health social worker and I'll see what he thinks.

For those that don't know me - I think everyone on this site that has met me would I agree that I'm just a normal, university educated, married father who had a good career and ran this site on the side for Leafs fans to hang out.  I'm not some maniacal axe-murder.  I've been hit very, very hard by this long episode of mental health - enough to disable me for at least the time being...  But I'm still the same old me otherwise...

I know how these situations effect people Rick.  I work in the health field, and the drugs I listed above are kind of the new rave.  All research I have done or seen is USA based though, so I don't know if they use it in Canada.  But definitely ask about these drugs, especially the ketamine.  I have seen patients with severe forms of depression, who by that afternoon, or the next morning, get the feeling back...that feeling of being motivated and wanting to do things.

He is one article on it:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2094250/Ketamine-Club-drug-offer-instant-remedy-severe-depression.html

 

[Bender]

Oh, dude, man...

I've only known one other person who has done this and she's fine now but it's still kind of shocking.

If it means anything, I'm very happy you're here with us now.

Yup, there's some pretty compelling reasons why I spent over 60 days in hospital since May - I think it was 5 different times I was admitted.

During one stay, they talked me into doing electric shock therapy (ECT it's called) on my poor old grey matter.  After 5 sessions, it wasn't working...

Depression, anxiety, and agoraphobia suck bigtime.  I'm a walking zombie on the amount of medications I take daily...

They still use ECT??? I thought that barbaric practice was discredited!!!

 

[sucka]

Have they prescribed a medicine for you that targets the glutamate neurotransmitters? 

No, I don't believe they have.  I have a meeting today with my mental health social worker and I'll see what he thinks.

For those that don't know me - I think everyone on this site that has met me would I agree that I'm just a normal, university educated, married father who had a good career and ran this site on the side for Leafs fans to hang out.  I'm not some maniacal axe-murder.  I've been hit very, very hard by this long episode of mental health - enough to disable me for at least the time being...  But I'm still the same old me otherwise...

I know how these situations effect people Rick.  I work in the health field, and the drugs I listed above are kind of the new rave.  All research I have done or seen is USA based though, so I don't know if they use it in Canada.  But definitely ask about these drugs, especially the ketamine.  I have seen patients with severe forms of depression, who by that afternoon, or the next morning, get the feeling back...that feeling of being motivated and wanting to do things.

He is one article on it:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2094250/Ketamine-Club-drug-offer-instant-remedy-severe-depression.html

Don't forget to get glow sticks too!  just kidding.  But with K, used by ravers along with ecstacy, are there coming down effects that can take you back to your initial state or even worse?

 

[lc9]

Don't forget to get glow sticks too!  just kidding.  But with K, used by ravers along with ecstacy, are there coming down effects that can take you back to your initial state or even worse?

That is the thing, there hasn't been any longitudinal studies completed yet, some are in the works.  But it is definitely make news in the depression world.  You never know what will fix ya until to accidentally discover what works.

 

[Stebro]

Anyone know of anymore research regarding depression. I've heard several ideas before, like lack of certain amino acids, inflammations, lack of vitamin d, lack of certain minerals, usually magnesium.

 

[sucka]

Don't forget to get glow sticks too!  just kidding.  But with K, used by ravers along with ecstacy, are there coming down effects that can take you back to your initial state or even worse?

That is the thing, there hasn't been any longitudinal studies completed yet, some are in the works.  But it is definitely make news in the depression world.  You never know what will fix ya until to accidentally discover what works.

I also read that some renegage practitioners (psychologists/psychiatrists) used ecstasy as part of their program and that it yielded positive results.  From my experiences back in the day, I didn't experience any negative state afterwards, just an occasional slurring of speech that lasted a few months.  But that's insignificant if the results are positive.  If it doesn't help at least you'll have what might be the most pleasant 6 hours of your life ever!  Never tried ketamine though.