General Leafs Talk: Post-Olympics Edition

[bustaheims]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

 

[Jalili]

Ignoring all other factors, one of Detroit/Columbus has already basically passed Toronto for the sheer fact that they both have 2 games in hand, and one is guaranteed a win over the other on Tuesday. Either one winning puts that team ahead of Toronto.

I think tomorrow's game in New Jersey is our absolute last chance to get things together.

 

[L K]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

For all the blame on Reimer for collapsing, how about we nail the coach who runs a team that falls apart over and over again.  Mental preparation has to fall under his portfolio.  This team is wilting.  I'd much rather see playoff hockey in general but I honestly am at the point where I would rather the team get rid of Carlyle.  We are never going to win with him running the ship.

 

[Bullfrog]

Ya, I'd rather see both happen, too. If I had to pick between one or the other, I'm leaning toward seeing Carlyle gone. It's nothing vindictive, I'm just not enjoying the hockey I'm seeing.

 

[bustaheims]

Ya, I'd rather see both happen, too. If I had to pick between one or the other, I'm leaning toward seeing Carlyle gone. It's nothing vindictive, I'm just not enjoying the hockey I'm seeing.

Yeah, and, despite how much I rag on him, I don't think Carlyle is a bad coach. I just think he's stuck on a system/style that isn't working and he's struggling to find a way to adapt on the fly. I think a season or two away from being a head coach at the NHL level could do him a world of good.

 

[bustaheims]

Washington also won last night, so, they pull within 1 point of the Leafs. Fortunately, they have no games in hand (though, they'll have one after tonight's game) and they're the only team in the playoff race that have less ROWs than the Leafs.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

For all the blame on Reimer for collapsing

And he's not even been that bad:

@ThomasDrance

James Reimer's EV sv% since Bernier went down with injury: .922 (or modestly better than average): http://timeonice.com/mplayershots1314.php?team=TOR&first=20995&last=21230

But when you require .920 to .925-ish goaltending in all situations total to win, then you're going to have some issues.

 

[Highlander]

Who do you get to replace Randy?  Lavoillette or Tortorelli?  Can't stand them, really who is available that can form a team and win?  Don't mention Mike Keegan or Pat Q? 

 

[ZBBM]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

For all the blame on Reimer for collapsing, how about we nail the coach who runs a team that falls apart over and over again.  Mental preparation has to fall under his portfolio.  This team is wilting.  I'd much rather see playoff hockey in general but I honestly am at the point where I would rather the team get rid of Carlyle.  We are never going to win with him running the ship.

And without major changes to the defensive corps.  People get all bothered when I suggest that trading Gardiner may be a necessary evil, but seriously, if we're stuck with Phaneuf (who is more an offensive d-man than a defensive one), and Gardiner is supposedly untouchable, and we all agree that Rielly is, and we all agree that Gunnarsson is not really the problem, then 4 out of the top 6 of a very poor defense are coming back.  You are not likely to get the upgrade you need out of moving Franson / Gleason / Ranger.

Yes, a different coach and a different system might well help.  But Friedman said it bluntly last night: there needs to be a major personnel upgrade.  You don't get there without trading one of Phaneuf / Gardiner / Rielly.  The question is, who's it going to be?  (BTW, in my perfect world it would be Phaneuf, not Gardiner.)

 

[Strangelove]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

For all the blame on Reimer for collapsing

And he's not even been that bad:

@ThomasDrance

James Reimer's EV sv% since Bernier went down with injury: .922 (or modestly better than average): http://timeonice.com/mplayershots1314.php?team=TOR&first=20995&last=21230

But when you require .920 to .925-ish goaltending in all situations total to win, then you're going to have some issues.

It's a massive stretch to say he hasn't been bad. Since playing well in the game he replaced Bernier he's stopping pucks at a clip well below .900, all in must-win games. Playing bad on the powerplay is still playing bad.

In general, I'm not convinced there needs to be a massive personnel switch, and would like to see what a coach other than Randy could do with the line-up.  If Nonis panics and start trading the young guys in the offseason I'm going to have a hard time cheering for this team.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

For all the blame on Reimer for collapsing

And he's not even been that bad:

@ThomasDrance

James Reimer's EV sv% since Bernier went down with injury: .922 (or modestly better than average): http://timeonice.com/mplayershots1314.php?team=TOR&first=20995&last=21230

But when you require .920 to .925-ish goaltending in all situations total to win, then you're going to have some issues.

It's a massive stretch to say he hasn't been bad.

Good thing I didn't say that then!

 

[Strangelove]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

For all the blame on Reimer for collapsing

And he's not even been that bad:

@ThomasDrance

James Reimer's EV sv% since Bernier went down with injury: .922 (or modestly better than average): http://timeonice.com/mplayershots1314.php?team=TOR&first=20995&last=21230

But when you require .920 to .925-ish goaltending in all situations total to win, then you're going to have some issues.

It's a massive stretch to say he hasn't been bad.

Good thing I didn't say that then!

It's also a massive stretch that he hasn't been that bad, if you want to get pedantic.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

It's also a massive stretch that he hasn't been that bad, if you want to get pedantic.

Aside from Montreal I don't think he cost the team any wins that they should have won.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

For all the blame on Reimer for collapsing

And he's not even been that bad:

@ThomasDrance

James Reimer's EV sv% since Bernier went down with injury: .922 (or modestly better than average): http://timeonice.com/mplayershots1314.php?team=TOR&first=20995&last=21230

But when you require .920 to .925-ish goaltending in all situations total to win, then you're going to have some issues.

It's a massive stretch to say he hasn't been bad.

Good thing I didn't say that then!

It's also a massive stretch that he hasn't been that bad, if you want to get pedantic.

Well I'm just saying, there's a fairly significant difference between me saying he's not been bad and not been that bad - one, to me, suggests he's been good and the other suggests he's been average/mediocre.

But I don't think he has been that bad.  Even in a small sample, EV SV% is still the vast majority of his minutes played, and he's done that at .922.  No, you can't totally ignore the other stuff, but I don't think he's been as bad as suggested.

 

[Strangelove]

It's also a massive stretch that he hasn't been that bad, if you want to get pedantic.

Aside from Montreal I don't think he cost the team any wins.

"Costing the team wins" is sort of a nebulous concept. I get what you mean. But I don't think we should underestimate the impact that his weak first period play has on the team's ability to play well for the rest of the night. He literally let in one of the first shots against in all four games he started, and proceeded to hang on, in mediocre fashion, for the rest of the game, leaving the team with an uphill battle. So whether or not he's "costing the team wins", he's a huge part of the problem right now.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

@mirtle

Wilson's last full season (2010-11), the Leafs had 80 points in regulation/OT. This year's team is on pace for 81. Which roster is better?

 

[Redleaf]

4 losses in a row, but I'm not sweating it: the way I see it, one of two things is going to happen:

a) The Leafs make the Playoffs for a second year in a row, or
b) Carlyle probably gets fired.

Is it wrong to root for b?

Carlyle being fired is the hopeful silver lining on the dark cloud that will be this season if they don't right the ship in a hurry - and, by in a hurry, I basically mean tomorrow.

For all the blame on Reimer for collapsing

And he's not even been that bad:

@ThomasDrance

James Reimer's EV sv% since Bernier went down with injury: .922 (or modestly better than average): http://timeonice.com/mplayershots1314.php?team=TOR&first=20995&last=21230

But when you require .920 to .925-ish goaltending in all situations total to win, then you're going to have some issues.

If Nonis panics and start trading the young guys in the offseason I'm going to have a hard time cheering for this team.

Not to mention a hard time retaining any respect for what Nonis has ever said in this regard.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

Damien Cox ‏@DamoSpin  5m
For those slagging Carlyle today, I get it. But were you praising his coaching when team was sizzling hot? Can't have it both ways.

Who is Damien talking to here?

 

[Redleaf]

It's also a massive stretch that he hasn't been that bad, if you want to get pedantic.

Aside from Montreal I don't think he cost the team any wins.

"Costing the team wins" is sort of a nebulous concept. I get what you mean. But I don't think we should underestimate the impact that his weak first period play has on the team's ability to play well for the rest of the night. He literally let in one of the first shots against in all four games he started, and proceeded to hang on, in mediocre fashion, for the rest of the game, leaving the team with an uphill battle. So whether or not he's "costing the team wins", he's a huge part of the problem right now.

Agreed. We can't underestimate the psychological impact he has on the rest of the team when he continues to give up weak goals in important games, and creates a mountain to climb game after game.

 

[Redleaf]

Damien Cox ‏@DamoSpin  5m
For those slagging Carlyle today, I get it. But were you praising his coaching when team was sizzling hot? Can't have it both ways.

Who is Damien talking to here?

Busta.......