Jake Gardiner

[Zee]

Yeah we all know Gardiner has a lot of growing and improving to do in the defensive zone, and it showed again tonight on some plays.

But it also didn't help him any that his defense partner was O'Byrne, who not only didn't contribute anything but is supposed to be a "shutdown" guy and defensive insurance for Gardiner. Instead he acts more like an usher, directing the Bruins to Reimer and eventually the back of the net.

Either way Jake was very solid offensively and I agree this experience is invaluable, especially because it's against the Bruins who are a pretty experienced and gritty playoff team.

Gardiner made some errors but so did many other players last night.  He also scored a goal and was generally dangerous all game long.  I don't recall anything that he did that directly led to a Boston goal, so the positives he brought last night way outweighed the negatives of any mistakes made.

 

[sneakyray]

...is awesome!

 

[hockeyfan1]

From:
http://blog.mapleleafs.com/gardiner-calls-fool-me-once-in-north-america-cup/

....the young Leafs blueliner was asked who he thought was the Leafs MVP this past season. He had two names that came to mind. ?I would have to say (James) Reimer and Naz (Kadri),? Gardiner said.

He was also asked who he thinks will win the Stanley Cup between Chicago and Boston.?I?m going to go with Chicago. No way I can pick Boston.?

 

[Redleaf]

From:
http://blog.mapleleafs.com/gardiner-calls-fool-me-once-in-north-america-cup/

....the young Leafs blueliner was asked who he thought was the Leafs MVP this past season. He had two names that came to mind. ?I would have to say (James) Reimer and Naz (Kadri),? Gardiner said.

He was also asked who he thinks will win the Stanley Cup between Chicago and Boston.?I?m going to go with Chicago. No way I can pick Boston.?

But in his heart of hearts he thinks the Bruins,

 

[slapshot]

I find it almost hard to believe Jake Gardiner's name popping up in trade rumours.
After last springs playoffs everyone was talking about him as cornerstone to build the team around, "skates like Niedermeyer" or reminds people of Brian Leetch.
Just because he continues to make a few mistakes here and there, he's still a young defenceman.
Just because we now have Rielly looking good, doesn't mean there isn't room for two of these guys. I like the fact that the Leafs can put a threat on the back-end with any defensive pairing. That being said, Gardiner being paired with Ranger is not helping him right now, until (and if) Ranger gets his his game together. But Carlyle didn't have much choice, unless he chooses to break up Phaneuf and Gunner because he had to put Franson with an even less experienced Rielly. Not ideal now that Fraser is out.
Eventually I see Stuart Percy as being another solid stay-home type of guy. He look very solid, calm and poised for a young guy who doesn't gamble like Gardiner or even Rielly.
Personally, at this point I think the whole trading the farm for a  "true" number 1 centre may not be necessary. I think we have enough game breakers and balanced attack over three lines, especially once Clarkson get back in and Kadri gets going again.
Keep Jake I say and let him develop along with Rielly.

 

[applecheeks]

I find it almost hard to believe Jake Gardiner's name popping up in trade rumours.
After last springs playoffs everyone was talking about him as cornerstone to build the team around, "skates like Niedermeyer" or reminds people of Brian Leetch.
Just because he continues to make a few mistakes here and there, he's still a young defenceman.
Just because we now have Rielly looking good, doesn't mean there isn't room for two of these guys. I like the fact that the Leafs can put a threat on the back-end with any defensive pairing. That being said, Gardiner being paired with Ranger is not helping him right now, until (and if) Ranger gets his his game together. But Carlyle didn't have much choice, unless he chooses to break up Phaneuf and Gunner because he had to put Franson with an even less experienced Rielly. Not ideal now that Fraser is out.
Eventually I see Stuart Percy as being another solid stay-home type of guy. He look very solid, calm and poised for a young guy who doesn't gamble like Gardiner or even Rielly.
Personally, at this point I think the whole trading the farm for a  "true" number 1 centre may not be necessary. I think we have enough game breakers and balanced attack over three lines, especially once Clarkson get back in and Kadri gets going again.
Keep Jake I say and let him develop along with Rielly.

Agreed. Rushing these young defensive prospects into action can't be a good thing. Considering D-men
take longer to mature and develop. It's great that we have some speed coming out of our zone, infact,
three possible prospects that can do that. But it is way too early to sell the farm when in fact it is our
Defence that is our weak link. Lets fix that before anything else. A #1 Centre will happen within if given
the chance. It is great that the team is seeing our young prospects getting a chance to make the BIG club.
I'm with you slapshot, hang on to Gardiner.

 

[Zee]

I find it hard to believe the Leafs are actively shopping Gardiner.  I imagine teams are interested in him and are calling asking about him.  You have to listen to all offers in case something blows your socks off, but I think that's all it is at this point.

 

[Bullfrog]

Agreed Zee. I think it's because of his talent and potential that the Leafs are probably getting lots of calls about him. I wouldn't want to trade him unless it's for a big return. But the team does have Rielly, who looks poised to fill his spot in a year or two.

Ultimately, I think it's a good thing that other teams want our players.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

My concern is that Carlyle seems to have no faith in Gardiner to let him play through mistakes, and that he has such influence over the roster that Gardiner won't be given the opportunity to reach his high ceiling as a Leaf.

I don't think at this point they would trade him, but I'm not entirely confident in saying that.

 

[Stickytape]

Yeah, I also worry that Carlyle is being a bit too hard on Gardiner, and that he's going to give him a similar treatment as he gave to Grabovski.  Hopefully Gardiner knows to keep his mouth shut and just look for his opportunity to prove himself again.

I like Gardiner and while I admit that he's had a rough couple games since the start of the season, I'm confident he'll get over it.  I'm at least glad that he got good minutes in the Ottawa game (21:23) and wound up a +2.

 

[Corn Flake]

My concern is that Carlyle seems to have no faith in Gardiner to let him play through mistakes, and that he has such influence over the roster that Gardiner won't be given the opportunity to reach his high ceiling as a Leaf.

I don't think at this point they would trade him, but I'm not entirely confident in saying that.

Did he have no faith in him when he played him 25 mins in the playoffs last year?

What about the 21 mins he played on saturday?

Does he have to play every other shift, all PP and PK time, last minute of every game and maybe play some goal before we believe Carlyle likes the kid?

This is so overblown it's ridiculous.

 

[Corn Flake]

Yeah, I also worry that Carlyle is being a bit too hard on Gardiner, and that he's going to give him a similar treatment as he gave to Grabovski.  Hopefully Gardiner knows to keep his mouth shut and just look for his opportunity to prove himself again.

in 1 of the 3 games played he had under 14 mins of ice time. The other two were 19 mins and 21 mins.  So one game where he got "benched" for a while.  so what?

Treated like Grabbo?  Carlyle and Grabbo were apparently not on speaking terms.  There's a clip of Carlyle and Gardiner from last week going through video together, talking and working out tweaks to his game.

O-VER-BLOWN.

 

[drummond]

If Gardiner is compared to Leetch, let?s not forget that Leetch was mistake prone as well. This happens quite a bit with offensive minded D-men. Do you remeber Coffey, Murphy even Housley to certain extent they all made quite a lot of defensive mistakes. Their offense was however superb. If Gardiners turns out into Leetch, I will be extremely happy. Sure it would be better to have another Al MacInnis or Nik Lidstrom, but those were unique players.

 

[Kin]

I don't advocate trading Gardiner, exactly, but I've long thought that the Leafs really couldn't go forward and expect their defense in the next few years to include all of Phaneuf, Gardiner, Franson and Rielly. I just don't think that would be a good enough top 4 defensively and I don't think any of those guys would be happy on a bottom pairing.

So the idea that the Leafs are feeling out which of those three they really want to commit to going forward strikes me as pretty reasonable considering that three of them have their contracts expiring this season. That doesn't mean Gardiner necessarily but if he's the most valuable of them in a trade, and he very well might be, then you should at least explore that option.

 

[Zee]

If Gardiner is compared to Leetch, let?s not forget that Leetch was mistake prone as well. This happens quite a bit with offensive minded D-men. Do you remeber Coffey, Murphy even Housley to certain extent they all made quite a lot of defensive mistakes. Their offense was however superb. If Gardiners turns out into Leetch, I will be extremely happy. Sure it would be better to have another Al MacInnis or Nik Lidstrom, but those were unique players.

Let's temper the Brian Leetch comparisons...Leetch was putting up a point a game at 20, 21 years of age.  He played 17 games at age 20 and put up 14 points, then his first full season he put up 71 points in 68 games.  Jake is already 23 years old and is nowhere near that level of offense.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

My concern is that Carlyle seems to have no faith in Gardiner to let him play through mistakes, and that he has such influence over the roster that Gardiner won't be given the opportunity to reach his high ceiling as a Leaf.

I don't think at this point they would trade him, but I'm not entirely confident in saying that.

Did he have no faith in him when he played him 25 mins in the playoffs last year?

What about the 21 mins he played on saturday?

Does he have to play every other shift, all PP and PK time, last minute of every game and maybe play some goal before we believe Carlyle likes the kid?

This is so overblown it's ridiculous.

No, it's based on it taking Carlyle until the playoffs last season to do what everyone was screaming for him to do - play Gardiner.  This isn't based off the 3 games this season.  Like I said, my concern is that, based on Carlyle's history with Gardiner last season it felt like him and Nonis needed to be forced to put Gardiner in the lineup.  There were articles last spring about how Carlyle should be playing Gardiner but was stubbornly refusing for some reason (some speculated because their relationship soured after Gardiner's first games last season).

Like I said, it's just concern at this point.  There's no panic.  Nothing about being concerned is overblown when you combine the above with news that the Leafs have been talking to other teams about him (in what capacity? We don't know).

 

[Zee]

My concern is that Carlyle seems to have no faith in Gardiner to let him play through mistakes, and that he has such influence over the roster that Gardiner won't be given the opportunity to reach his high ceiling as a Leaf.

I don't think at this point they would trade him, but I'm not entirely confident in saying that.

Did he have no faith in him when he played him 25 mins in the playoffs last year?

What about the 21 mins he played on saturday?

Does he have to play every other shift, all PP and PK time, last minute of every game and maybe play some goal before we believe Carlyle likes the kid?

This is so overblown it's ridiculous.

No, it's based on it taking Carlyle until the playoffs last season to do what everyone was screaming for him to do - play Gardiner.  This isn't based off the 3 games this season.  Like I said, my concern is that, based on Carlyle's history with Gardiner last season it felt like him and Nonis needed to be forced to put Gardiner in the lineup.  There were articles last spring about how Carlyle should be playing Gardiner but was stubbornly refusing for some reason (some speculated because their relationship soured after Gardiner's first games last season).

Like I said, it's just concern at this point.  There's no panic.  Nothing about being concerned is overblown when you combine the above with news that the Leafs have been talking to other teams about him (in what capacity? We don't know).

Last season though, Gardiner was coming off that concussion and by all accounts he wasn't the same player at the Marlies for a good long while.  He finally got his game together, had that famous agent #FreeJakeGardiner tweet and finally got into the lineup.  Carlyle then used him ALOT in the Boston series, so if he plays well, Carlyle has no issues playing big minutes out of him.

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

My concern is that Carlyle seems to have no faith in Gardiner to let him play through mistakes, and that he has such influence over the roster that Gardiner won't be given the opportunity to reach his high ceiling as a Leaf.

I don't think at this point they would trade him, but I'm not entirely confident in saying that.

Did he have no faith in him when he played him 25 mins in the playoffs last year?

What about the 21 mins he played on saturday?

Does he have to play every other shift, all PP and PK time, last minute of every game and maybe play some goal before we believe Carlyle likes the kid?

This is so overblown it's ridiculous.

No, it's based on it taking Carlyle until the playoffs last season to do what everyone was screaming for him to do - play Gardiner.  This isn't based off the 3 games this season.  Like I said, my concern is that, based on Carlyle's history with Gardiner last season it felt like him and Nonis needed to be forced to put Gardiner in the lineup.  There were articles last spring about how Carlyle should be playing Gardiner but was stubbornly refusing for some reason (some speculated because their relationship soured after Gardiner's first games last season).

Like I said, it's just concern at this point.  There's no panic.  Nothing about being concerned is overblown when you combine the above with news that the Leafs have been talking to other teams about him (in what capacity? We don't know).

Last season though, Gardiner was coming off that concussion and by all accounts he wasn't the same player at the Marlies for a good long while.  He finally got his game together, had that famous agent #FreeJakeGardiner tweet and finally got into the lineup.  Carlyle then used him ALOT in the Boston series, so if he plays well, Carlyle has no issues playing big minutes out of him.

There were articles for a good while about his play with the Marlies before he was called up.

 

[Corn Flake]

I don't advocate trading Gardiner, exactly, but I've long thought that the Leafs really couldn't go forward and expect their defense in the next few years to include all of Phaneuf, Gardiner, Franson and Rielly. I just don't think that would be a good enough top 4 defensively and I don't think any of those guys would be happy on a bottom pairing.

So the idea that the Leafs are feeling out which of those three they really want to commit to going forward strikes me as pretty reasonable considering that three of them have their contracts expiring this season. That doesn't mean Gardiner necessarily but if he's the most valuable of them in a trade, and he very well might be, then you should at least explore that option.

I think that's the approach as well.  Really need to see what Rielly can do and how quickly he's going to get to a level where he can play 20 mins / night.  If he can stay at the NHL level and be effective, it could change a lot.

With Gardiner, while he's still relatively young and learning the position, he does have that deer in the headlights look about him at times and I wonder if the consistency issues are going to continue.  We see players like this often not able to fully iron out the kinks on a permanent basis.  He may or may not be that guy but so far, he hasn't been able to reach a high level and stay there.

Certainly agree that going forward that top 4 isn't likely to work.  I think it has to be two of the 4 guys you mentioned, Gunarsson as the #4 and they have to find a legit top pairing defensive d-man who can shore things up in that area.

 

[Corn Flake]

If Gardiner is compared to Leetch, let?s not forget that Leetch was mistake prone as well. This happens quite a bit with offensive minded D-men. Do you remeber Coffey, Murphy even Housley to certain extent they all made quite a lot of defensive mistakes. Their offense was however superb. If Gardiners turns out into Leetch, I will be extremely happy. Sure it would be better to have another Al MacInnis or Nik Lidstrom, but those were unique players.

Rielly is compared to Leetch.  Gardiner is not. At least not that I've heard.