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Leafs ranked WORST sports team?

Nik the Trik said:
Regardless, this doesn't have to be razor-accurate to have validity. Do you think the poll is wrong in stating that Leafs fans have a comparatively low opinion of their coach? Their ownership? That fans feel they're not getting good value for their money? You might quibble whether or not Leafs fans feel worse about those things than Knicks fans but that's a pretty minor bone to pick.
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No. I think it's relatively accurate. I just feel it's meaningless, unnecessary and poorly represented. It just doesn't really provide any information past "successful teams tend to have happier fans," which is pretty common knowledge.
 
bustaheims said:
No. I think it's relatively accurate. I just feel it's meaningless, unnecessary and poorly represented. It just doesn't really provide any information past "successful teams tend to have happier fans," which is pretty common knowledge.
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Which is fair enough, I don't think they're trying to re-invent the wheel here. I think the value in something like this is seeing, for instance, how much opinion of Carlyle has dropped within the last year or how much people in Oakland hate the coliseum.

Still, that's something very different than thinking 1,000 people isn't a valid sample size for an opinion poll. At that point it's a problem with the concept of polling in general and while people in market research might not think much of your major polling firms even the worst of them, when they're doing something as comparatively major as a Presidential election, will be off by, at worst, single digit percentage points. 
 
Nik the Trik said:
Still, that's something very different than thinking 1,000 people isn't a valid sample size for an opinion poll. At that point it's a problem with the concept of polling in general and while people in market research might not think much of your major polling firms even the worst of them, when they're doing something as comparatively major as a Presidential election, will be off by, at worst, single digit percentage points.
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Well, I have my doubts they received anywhere near 1000 respondents for a good number of the major league teams they presented data for, which is a problem. There's also been some pretty serious discrepancies with polling firms and elections in recent history - especially when there's more than 2 options available. They were significantly off base when it came to the recent Ontario election, for instance, and a lot of that has to do with their methodology, which is largely outdated.
 
bustaheims said:
Well, I have my doubts they received anywhere near 1000 respondents for a good number of the major league teams they presented data for, which is a problem.
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That may be true but A) I would imagine they had pretty significant minimums and maximums for each team to normalize data and B) I have to assume that, going by what I know about ESPN, the Leafs aren't likely to be a team that would be comparatively under-represented. Unless you think it was a bunch of super-impressed tourists that voted Real Sports the best Sports Bar in North America I'd bet ESPN does ok by Toronto traffic.

bustaheims said:
There's also been some pretty serious discrepancies with polling firms and elections in recent history - especially when there's more than 2 options available. They were significantly off base when it came to the recent Ontario election, for instance, and a lot of that has to do with their methodology, which is largely outdated.
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In terms of general opinion polls the biggest discrepancy between the last polls and the Liberal's actual % of votes received was 5 points. In terms of likely voters it was 8. That's not great and that certainly could be the difference between winning and losing but none of them massively, or even significantly, misrepresented political opinion in the province.
 
the only rank i care about is the one at the end of the season..no amount of polls are going to change how i feel about this team..if it were a rational decision i would have given up watching them years ago. 
 
it reminds me of the joke of the extremley rich kid whom goes to Disneyland and when he gets home, he askes his Dad to buy him a Mickey Mouse outfit. So his father relents and buys his son the Toronto Maple Leafs..  Actually in the first version of the joke it was the Argos, whom are the worst franchise in sports. LOL
 
ESPN is basically saying the Leafs skated about 10 times this summer - but 6 of those times were on double dates so they don't count. CHEESEBURGERS
 
ESPN ran an article to go along with the ranking by Chris Jones, an Esquire writer and Toronto Native and despite it being by someone who seems pretty self-serious about his ex-fandom I thought it was pretty good.

Why I Turned on the Maple Leafs

For a long time, I blamed Leafs fans and their blind loyalty for their team's failings. They rewarded sin with virtue, and that made them both enablers and dumb consumers. I'm sorry for thinking that way. That's like believing an absence of heart can be remedied with a growing heartlessness.
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I don't know...

ESPN does have a point, but I'm probably going to wait for Sports Illustrated to tell me what to think before I form an uneducated opinion on rankings. :P
 
Sudafederov said:
I don't know...

ESPN does have a point, but I'm probably going to wait for Sports Illustrated to tell me what to think before I form an uneducated opinion on rankings. :P
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I really don't get why this attitude persists. Between Lebrun, Burnside, Custance and Down Goes Brown ESPN has as good a collection of hockey writers as just about anywhere.
 
You forgot Buccigross.

It's a big brand. You can have great writers and entities (Outside the Lines) and still put out clickbait.
 
Sudafederov said:
You forgot Buccigross.

It's a big brand. You can have great writers and entities (Outside the Lines) and still put out clickbait.
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I agree that this is overly sensational but I don't think it's because ESPN is somehow ignorant or uneducated when it comes to hockey or the Leafs.
 
Nik the Trik said:
I really don't get why this attitude persists. Between Lebrun, Burnside, Custance and Down Goes Brown ESPN has as good a collection of hockey writers as just about anywhere.
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I'd add Pronman to that list too. Unfortunately it seems like a bunch of those guys only have articles behind a paywall so not everybody is seeing them.
 
Let's face it, the Leafs ARE the worst.  They never develop any of their own players.  Despite having the highest payroll they are mediocre at best every year.  Ticket prices are insane and you can't even buy them if you want some.  The ACC is filled with corporate clients who don't even watch the game or cheer.  It has become a joke.
 
sickbeast said:
Let's face it, the Leafs ARE the worst.  They never develop any of their own players.  Despite having the highest payroll they are mediocre at best every year.  Ticket prices are insane and you can't even buy them if you want some.  The ACC is filled with corporate clients who don't even watch the game or cheer.  It has become a joke.
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ADD - any team that's only made the post-season once in the past decade + should be littered with high end / top prospects at every position.
 
Add -  most of the people that can legitimately remember the leafs winning the cup are 50+ years of age.

The organization has done jack &%^*& Cup wise in the 30 years I've been watching.  I am so tired of them talking about the great tradition the club has.  I barf every time they show any highlights in black and white.
 
If all that were true (and it is), you gotta ask yourself why are you still a fan? 

There is such a thing as loyalty.  But loyalty in the face of poor performance is only given to a team that suffers from some sort of grave disadvantage (ie money woes).  The Leafs have no disadvantage to speak of, in fact the Leafs may be the most advantaged team in the world.

And yet (AND YET!!!!) they can't even come close to competing for the Stanley Cup...they can't even make the playoffs anymore. 

It's like the noble barbarian who charges into battle knowing they'll die but at least they'll die with honour.  That can only go on for so long until that honour starts to look more and more like stupidity. 

That's Leafs fans in a nutshell.  There's a fine line between honour/loyalty and foolishness/stupidity.  But Leafs fans have crossed over into the foolishness camp a long time ago.

But greedy corporations love fools :)
 
895 said:
If all that were true (and it is), you gotta ask yourself why are you still a fan? 

There is such a thing as loyalty.  But loyalty in the face of poor performance is only given to a team that suffers from some sort of grave disadvantage (ie money woes).  The Leafs have no disadvantage to speak of, in fact the Leafs may be the most advantaged team in the world.

And yet (AND YET!!!!) they can't even come close to competing for the Stanley Cup...they can't even make the playoffs anymore. 

It's like the noble barbarian who charges into battle knowing they'll die but at least they'll die with honour.  That can only go on for so long until that honour starts to look more and more like stupidity. 

That's Leafs fans in a nutshell.  There's a fine line between honour/loyalty and foolishness/stupidity.  But Leafs fans have crossed over into the foolishness camp a long time ago.

But greedy corporations love fools :)
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Not like I can just "switch" allegiances to another team, I've grown up cheering for the Leafs, so I'll continue to support them.  That being said, it's not a major part of my life, I don't get worked up over wins and losses like when I was a teenager.  My family means far more than a sport ever will, but if the Leafs ever finally manage to win it all, I'll be celebrating in the streets with the rest of the fans.
 
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