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Tank Nation: Matthews Edition

Edmonton drafts first every year and now Cicerelli is offering up just about anyone except McDavid saying his door is open for business. 
 
Nik the Trik said:
Not a ton. Chiefly it looks like he's played with guys like Gagner, Roy and Purcell but there's some RNH, Eberle and Hall at 5 on 5. Certainly enough so that you couldn't say it's never been tried. Without busting out the Excel spreadsheet I couldn't really get into the Chicken or the Egg of that though.
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His career 5-on-5 P/60 is 1.49 (about a standard rate for a 3rd liner). His P/60 with RNH is 0.78 and with Eberle it's 0.83. So he definitely hasn't clicked with those guys in his career. His point totals and ice-time with each of them is pretty similar so they've likely been a line every time Yakupov was with them. I would guess that that drop could be somewhat explained by the fact that Yakupov is probably playing the left-side on that line and he's a natural right-winger.

Hall's a slightly different story. Yakupov has 11 career points in 215:02 minutes with Hall on the ice. That's a 3.07 P/60, which is very good. Pretty small sample though, Hall is his 10th most common linemate in his career.

And of course he and McDavid had a pretty good run of games before Connor's injury. 7 points in 146:06 minutes of ice-time. P/60 of 2.88.

So he's looked good with Hall and McDavid in small stretches, but the problem is Eberle has generally been blocking his path to the right-wing spot with those guys.
 
CarltonTheBear said:
So he's looked good with Hall and McDavid in small stretches, but the problem is Eberle has generally been blocking his path to the right-wing spot with those guys.
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So, basically, he produces well when playing with guys who produce well regardless of who they're playing with, but not so much when playing with guys who don't?
 
bustaheims said:
So, basically, he produces well when playing with guys who produce well regardless of who they're playing with, but not so much when playing with guys who don't?
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I'd say that he's produced at a very, very good rate in limited minutes with McDavid or Hall. Very poorly in slightly less limited minutes playing out of position with RNH-Eberle. And at a respectable rate in his most common situation: playing 3rd line minutes with 3rd liners.

I'm not saying that he hasn't been a very disappointing 1st overall pick, or that teams should be lining up to give Edmonton top-4 defencemen for him. But there's still hope for him to be a complementary player in a top-6.
 
I would say, if the Oilers were smart, they would have kept McDavid and Yakupov a pairing when Connor came back and had Eberle play with Hall. The rest of this season serves no purpose. Letting Yakupov finish the season with McDavid could have at least potentially helped them give him some trade value.

I would also say that if the Oilers were looking to move him I'd give them a call. Obviously wouldn't pay a huge price but nobody would. How about Hunwick for Yakupov?
 
CarltonTheBear said:
I would say, if the Oilers were smart, they would have kept McDavid and Yakupov a pairing when Connor came back and had Eberle play with Hall. The rest of this season serves no purpose. Letting Yakupov finish the season with McDavid could have at least potentially helped them give him some trade value.

I would also say that if the Oilers were looking to move him I'd give them a call. Obviously wouldn't pay a huge price but nobody would. How about Hunwick for Yakupov?
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His value hasn't fallen that far.
 
CarltonTheBear said:
Patrick said:
His value hasn't fallen that far.
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Hunwick's or Yakupov's? I just couldn't tell who you think would say no.
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There is no way Yakupov's value has fallen to the point that the return on him would be a journeyman NHL'er who has been objectively atrocious this year and spent parts of last in the AHL.

Probably one of the D prospects and a 2nd/3rd round pick I think.
 
Patrick said:
There is no way Yakupov's value has fallen to the point that the return on him would be a journeyman NHL'er who has been objectively atrocious this year and spent parts of last in the AHL.

Probably one of the D prospects and a 2nd/3rd round pick I think.
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I feel like Hunwick's value is higher than that right now. Granted, I agree with you for sure but NHL teams probably see him in a much better light than that. Especially one as desperate and dumb as Edmonton. They'll see him as a guy who Mike Babcock, arguably the best coach in the world, is trusting to play a lot of very tough minutes. Babcock's also constantly spoken highly of his character and experience. I wouldn't be surprised if teams pegged him as a solid #4 guy right now. And again, to be clear, they absolutely shouldn't. But NHL teams have proven time and time again that they're great at being wrong.

Maybe Hunwick alone doesn't get the deal done, but I could see him as the main piece.
 
Patrick said:
[youtube]JRyIgatcTAs
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Peter Chiarelli ladies and gentlemen, CtB you're right Hunwick probably will get it done.
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Chiarelli didn't strike me as immediately incompetent, but the rest of his round table was scary bad.
 
Potvin29 said:
"He's not a physical player.  He relies all on his skill."  Help me.
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And people wonder why the Bruins made so many poor decisions and fell off so quickly.

EDIT: I hope most of these guys still run the Bruins, and that Chiarelli has taken the same viewpoint to Edmonton.
 
herman said:
Chiarelli didn't strike me as immediately incompetent, but the rest of his round table was scary bad.
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I think intelligent executives surround themselves with other intelligent hockey people. It seems like he created an echo chamber there. The trade negotiation segment didn't look good on him either. The financial mismanagement that led to them having to trade key players away.

Trading the 16th overall pick for Griffin Reinhart doesn't look like a good deal either and that was his first big move as Oilers GM. Reinhart not playing on a d-core that is as bad as theirs is now, does not bode well for the future.
 
Patrick said:
herman said:
Chiarelli didn't strike me as immediately incompetent, but the rest of his round table was scary bad.
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I think intelligent executives surround themselves with other intelligent hockey people. It seems like he created an echo chamber there. The trade negotiation segment didn't look good on him either. The financial mismanagement that led to them having to trade key players away.

Trading the 16th overall pick for Griffin Reinhart doesn't look like a good deal either and that was his first big move as Oilers GM. Reinhart not playing on a d-core that is as bad as theirs is now, does not bode well for the future.
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That's a great point re: echo chamber. I kind of think it s a similar situation on most teams, where formerly effective philosophies still have tremendous inertia.
 
Patrick said:
I think intelligent executives surround themselves with other intelligent hockey people. It seems like he created an echo chamber there. The trade negotiation segment didn't look good on him either. The financial mismanagement that led to them having to trade key players away.
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Which is a pretty stark contrast to how things have supposedly worked with the Leafs since Shanahan cleaned house. There were some reportedly heated arguments over some transactions/decisions leading up to the draft.
 
Patrick said:
I think intelligent executives surround themselves with other intelligent hockey people. It seems like he created an echo chamber there.
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To be fair that's coming from a Boston approved/edited bit of footage. They're probably not going to show serious disagreements if they do exist.
 
Highlander said:
Edmonton drafts first every year and now Cicerelli is offering up just about anyone except McDavid saying his door is open for business.
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I am not sure if people have checked out this site as a draft resource. It has a history of the drafts as well as a collection of mock drafts of each year but what I really enjoy is the 20/20 draft feature they call 'Re-draft'.  Looking at the Oiler's selections in particular:

http://www.draftsite.com/nhl/redraft/2010/
Seguin going 1st, Hall dropping to 4th

http://www.draftsite.com/nhl/redraft/2011/
Landeskog going 1st, RNH actually dropped to 7th (ouch!)

http://www.draftsite.com/nhl/redraft/2012/
Trouba going 1st, Yakupov dropping to 4th

http://www.draftsite.com/nhl/redraft/2014/
Actually has Draisaitl going 1st instead of 3rd

I just really hope the Leafs get Matthews but as noted elsewhere, any of the top 6 are good.
 
It also has Nylander dropping to 13th and noted 4th liner and best prospect ever Curtis Lazar moving up 4 spots in his draft.

Someone burn it, burn it to the ground.
 
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