The Brian Burke Thread

[Mikhail Bloodnovsky]

Should Burke be fired?  I waver on that.  But Burke should take this season as a big fat cue to knock off with the know-it-all bravado and bluster.  He's just been served a very big piece of humble pie, and needs to finish every crumb like a good boy.

I don't see why it should matter how much bravado and bluster he has.  That is who he is, that is who he has always been, and that's likely part of the reason he has reached this level.

But I don't see why it should matter to you as a fan.  Personally, when he goes on some kind of rant I typically smirk when reading/hearing/seeing it, and then move on.  I don't take any of it too serious unless it's a press conference for something, and even then, I think it's fairly easy to tell when he's just putting it on for the media.

I know it shouldn't matter but having Peter Molyneux of hockey GMs is starting to get tiresome.

 

[ZBBM]

Should Burke be fired?  I waver on that.  But Burke should take this season as a big fat cue to knock off with the know-it-all bravado and bluster.  He's just been served a very big piece of humble pie, and needs to finish every crumb like a good boy.

I don't see why it should matter how much bravado and bluster he has.  That is who he is, that is who he has always been, and that's likely part of the reason he has reached this level.

But I don't see why it should matter to you as a fan.  Personally, when he goes on some kind of rant I typically smirk when reading/hearing/seeing it, and then move on.  I don't take any of it too serious unless it's a press conference for something, and even then, I think it's fairly easy to tell when he's just putting it on for the media.

As a fan I want to have a bit of pride in the franchise, and since Burke has failed to deliver anything on the ice it would be nice he didn't act like a buffoon off of it.  Being a blowhard is a side effect of his success, not the cause of it.  He could be supremely self-confident and still keep his mouth shut.

 

[Zee]

Should Burke be fired?  I waver on that.  But Burke should take this season as a big fat cue to knock off with the know-it-all bravado and bluster.  He's just been served a very big piece of humble pie, and needs to finish every crumb like a good boy.

Good luck with that.  He maintains to this day he could have had the Leafs in the playoffs each of the last two seasons by dealing away prospects at the deadline to add veterans.  RIGHT.  He seems to think he knows exactly how to get this team to the post season but he's not interested in just making it in, he wants a parade.

 

[Optimus Reimer]

Should Burke be fired?  I waver on that.  But Burke should take this season as a big fat cue to knock off with the know-it-all bravado and bluster.  He's just been served a very big piece of humble pie, and needs to finish every crumb like a good boy.

I don't think he is going anywhere but he needs to dial down on his arrogance.

Why wouldn't Burke be fired?  What has he done to make this team better since the day he started? 

When he first came on board, I figured it would take 3 seasons for the Leafs to make the playoffs with the team gradually improving each season.  Season 1 - assess the players, get rid of the crap and bring in new players.  Season 2 - tinker with the line up to make the team better.  Fill in the gaps and weaknesses on the team.  Season 3 - bring in some veteran experience for picks and/or one of the excess d-men to provide the team with some playoff presence on and off the ice to help the team make the playoffs in 6th to 8th place.

Instead the team has not made the playoffs since the lockout.  Why is MLSE the only company that I know of that rewards its employees with futility?

 

[GhostofPotvin29]

Should Burke be fired?  I waver on that.  But Burke should take this season as a big fat cue to knock off with the know-it-all bravado and bluster.  He's just been served a very big piece of humble pie, and needs to finish every crumb like a good boy.

I don't see why it should matter how much bravado and bluster he has.  That is who he is, that is who he has always been, and that's likely part of the reason he has reached this level.

But I don't see why it should matter to you as a fan.  Personally, when he goes on some kind of rant I typically smirk when reading/hearing/seeing it, and then move on.  I don't take any of it too serious unless it's a press conference for something, and even then, I think it's fairly easy to tell when he's just putting it on for the media.

As a fan I want to have a bit of pride in the franchise, and since Burke has failed to deliver anything on the ice it would be nice he didn't act like a buffoon off of it.  Being a blowhard is a side effect of his success, not the cause of it.  He could be supremely self-confident and still keep his mouth shut.

Well we'll have to disagree that he acts like a buffoon off the ice.  I for one have found much to take pride in when it comes to Burke (top of the list would probably be his charity work and his role in the YouCanPlay stuff), but if you just want to see the negative side to his personality, then so be it.

I don't know to what degree he can change his personality.  I know I have trouble changing mine as much as I've tried in the past.  As far as I can tell from his past GM spots, he's always been one to talk loudly whenever he's been asked to speak, so it's nothing I have not expected, and again doesn't really bother me one way or another.

 

[TML fan]

Should Burke be fired?  I waver on that.  But Burke should take this season as a big fat cue to knock off with the know-it-all bravado and bluster.  He's just been served a very big piece of humble pie, and needs to finish every crumb like a good boy.

I don't think he is going anywhere but he needs to dial down on his arrogance.

Why wouldn't Burke be fired?  What has he done to make this team better since the day he started? 

When he first came on board, I figured it would take 3 seasons for the Leafs to make the playoffs with the team gradually improving each season.  Season 1 - assess the players, get rid of the crap and bring in new players.  Season 2 - tinker with the line up to make the team better.  Fill in the gaps and weaknesses on the team.  Season 3 - bring in some veteran experience for picks and/or one of the excess d-men to provide the team with some playoff presence on and off the ice to help the team make the playoffs in 6th to 8th place.

Instead the team has not made the playoffs since the lockout.  Why is MLSE the only company that I know of that rewards its employees with futility?

Burke has gotten a lot of poor performances out of players. Particularly his goalies. What you think you have, and what you have are often two very different things.

It's hard to tinker with a roster that is so inconsistent from game to game, let alone season to season.

In my opinion, the only players on this team who have been consistent or steadily improving since Burke took over are Kessel, Grabovski, and Gunnarsson (and even Grabovski had that off year).

 

[Mikhail Bloodnovsky]

Should Burke be fired?  I waver on that.  But Burke should take this season as a big fat cue to knock off with the know-it-all bravado and bluster.  He's just been served a very big piece of humble pie, and needs to finish every crumb like a good boy.

I don't think he is going anywhere but he needs to dial down on his arrogance.

Instead the team has not made the playoffs since the lockout.  Why is MLSE the only company that I know of that rewards its employees with futility?

Colangelo has been at the helm of mediocrity for 6 years now and MLSE doesn't seem to mind.

 

[Leaflifer]

...Burke should take this season as a big fat cue to knock off with the know-it-all bravado and bluster.  He's just been served a very big piece of humble pie, and needs to finish every crumb like a good boy.

Burke can't do that. That's who he is  I used to actually feel sorry for him when Ron McLean used to bait him on HNIC for a little fun. He would get all bent out of shape from some comment about Leaf fans in Vancouver, or reffing, or whatever.

I would think, here's a guy who has little self control and lets his emotions get the best of him.

I wasn't a happy camper when the Leafs hired him.

 

[armche123]

Anyone that wants to fire Burke, honestly, doesnt know anything about what has been taking place over the last 3 years, as well has no idea what pains Leaf fans have been through. Its a process, and everyone knows that. It hurts not making the playoffs, but we are still building, and have most of the right pieces in place, especially compared to where we were.

This firing Burke business sounds more like media type people trying to infultrate every aspect of Leafs coverage to try and ruin his name, what he's done and what he is continually bringing to the table. This, IMO, is sad.

I really have given up on this yr. and hope to see what becomes of this team next yr, I think the leafs are headed in the right direction.

I still believe all we need is 1 more player on the top line.

Till next season!

 

[Optimus Reimer]

Anyone that wants to fire Burke, honestly, doesnt know anything about what has been taking place over the last 3 years, as well has no idea what pains Leaf fans have been through. Its a process, and everyone knows that. It hurts not making the playoffs, but we are still building, and have most of the right pieces in place, especially compared to where we were.

This firing Burke business sounds more like media type people trying to infultrate every aspect of Leafs coverage to try and ruin his name, what he's done and what he is continually bringing to the table. This, IMO, is sad.

I really have given up on this yr. and hope to see what becomes of this team next yr, I think the leafs are headed in the right direction.

I still believe all we need is 1 more player on the top line.

Till next season!

And decent goaltending, better defensive coverage, less turnovers, a better transition from defence to offence, and an extra body with actual playoff experience and success.

Maybe a problem in Leafland is that we are content in hoping for better things next season, not realizing that things have not improved from the season before, or the season before that one.  In each of the last 3 seasons, the team has suffered through a long losing streak that basically eliminated the team from playoff consideration. 

 

[Leaflifer]

Anyone that wants to fire Burke, honestly, doesnt know anything about what has been taking place over the last 3 years, as well has no idea what pains Leaf fans have been through. Its a process, and everyone knows that. It hurts not making the playoffs, but we are still building, and have most of the right pieces in place, especially compared to where we were.

This firing Burke business sounds more like media type people trying to infultrate every aspect of Leafs coverage to try and ruin his name, what he's done and what he is continually bringing to the table. This, IMO, is sad.

I really have given up on this yr. and hope to see what becomes of this team next yr, I think the leafs are headed in the right direction.

I still believe all we need is 1 more player on the top line.

Till next season!

I was the blue kool-aid drinker around here when JFJ was in charge, always thinking "it takes time..."

I don't really think much about firing Burke, I didn't like the choice to begin with, therefore I have always thought it was just a matter of time.

I know this has been said before, but doesn't it seem odd that he talked about building a big tough team from the back-end out, and basically he hasn't done that at all?

Does he actually know where he is going with this team?

I admit I will more excited about the team if the Leafs start winning, but they do look pretty far away from playing .700+  hockey throughout the course of a whole season.

 

[Guru Tugginmypuddah]

Instead the team has not made the playoffs since the lockout.  Why is MLSE the only company that I know of that rewards its employees with futility?

By corporate standards, MLSE is very very very very far from futility.

 

[Corn Flake]

Parise told friends (according to the Toronto Sun's Steve Simmons) that he wouldn't consider the Leafs in free agency this summmer..

Source:  ESPN Rumour Central

This stuff, again....?.......

 

[Strangelove]

Anyone that wants to fire Burke, honestly, doesnt know anything about what has been taking place over the last 3 years, as well has no idea what pains Leaf fans have been through. Its a process, and everyone knows that. It hurts not making the playoffs, but we are still building, and have most of the right pieces in place, especially compared to where we were.

This firing Burke business sounds more like media type people trying to infultrate every aspect of Leafs coverage to try and ruin his name, what he's done and what he is continually bringing to the table. This, IMO, is sad.

I really have given up on this yr. and hope to see what becomes of this team next yr, I think the leafs are headed in the right direction.

I still believe all we need is 1 more player on the top line.

Till next season!

This simply isn't true.  There are replacement level players all over the team, from the goalie, through the captain, through each centerman, right on out.  He has built a small, weak, underskilled team that quite evidently has little idea what it wants to be, and he has paid far too much to do it.  There isn't even the hint of a truly competitive core in the Leafs' line-up, which, after three years, means that Burke's tenure has been a profound and utter failure.

 

[Zee]

Anyone that wants to fire Burke, honestly, doesnt know anything about what has been taking place over the last 3 years, as well has no idea what pains Leaf fans have been through. Its a process, and everyone knows that. It hurts not making the playoffs, but we are still building, and have most of the right pieces in place, especially compared to where we were.

This firing Burke business sounds more like media type people trying to infultrate every aspect of Leafs coverage to try and ruin his name, what he's done and what he is continually bringing to the table. This, IMO, is sad.

I really have given up on this yr. and hope to see what becomes of this team next yr, I think the leafs are headed in the right direction.

I still believe all we need is 1 more player on the top line.

Till next season!

Failure is failure pure and simple.  It doesn't help Burke's case that he seems to change his mind mid-stride as well.  Originally he came in saying the Leafs would be a big tough team, not get pushed around, and then goes out and trades for Kessel, one of the softest players in recent memory.  Look up and down this roster, we are full of players who can get pushed around.

Burke has also gone on record with his analogy about how a team improves, you have to crawl, then walk, then run, then sprint.  He went so far as to say the Leafs were now "running" this season.  C'mon man, someone has to hold him accountable for his grand statements that ultimately have led to no success.  This team will finish with a WORSE record than last season, i.e. they are regressing.

 

[TML fan]

Sometimes when you're running, you fall down. NOBODY expected the Leafs to fall off the face of the Earth, and making a deadline trade wouldn't have changed that.

 

[armche123]

No one is saying that your concerns are not warrented; however the Leafs do have all the pieces in place to make a serious push for it next year, with the right additions.

Firing Burke is not the answer though, and its somewhat juvenile to think that after someone (and his team) have spent so long to get all the wrong players off the team, and the (so far) right pieces in place, the team needs some time to gel, with their new coach.

This year was supposed to be the year for our BIG Foward acquisition, it didn?t happen because, IMO, CLB backed out and surprised EVERYONE involved... this led to the Leafs being somewhat hopeless down the stretch.. and someone had to take the wrap.. possibly the coach that brought, the players moving forward with the team, together. Wilson, whos been friends with Burke for 40 yrs, was just the filler till we got the coach of the future...

Enter Carlyle... The coach Burke wanted for the future, once his line-up was pretty well set out.. (Unfortunatley without our BIG Forward...).

Now we are where we are, IMO, because that deal never went through and the media scrutiny post-trade deadline...

Failure IS failure though.. but we (the people of this board) kinda knew where everything was going into the trade deadline... so seeming the fact the trade didn?t materialize, doesn?t mean, ok fire the GM... c'mon.. where's the business saviness that i enjoyed reading for so many years on this site...

No offence.. but all im reading is negative rhetoric that contradicts everyone?s acceptance that Burke did a great job all up until the trade deadline.. Then we all got screwed.

Really? I, for the record, still believe in Burke, and what he has brought this city. Its moving forward fine, but our players do need the want to win.. and that is not only based on their performance (which was shown on full display for the first 4 months of the season), the media (which will stupidly NEVER be on their side) and the fans (which are quieter and quieter every game)..

I dont think fans and media are wrong in not supporting the team.. but i also dont think its Burkes fault entirely to the point he needs to get fired..

 

[lamajama]

I still have a little faith in Burke. It's certainly dropped in the last year
but the one thing that does give me pause is that he has a number of very competent henchmen. Collectively I still believe in them.

What I wish is that he would drop the arrogance - which is very unlikely. I despise arrogance but it's even worse when nothing you have done backs up whatever you are being arrogant about. Don't like the media coverage (which I do agree that they are a problem - but far less than in previous years) then get the team competitive. 

 

[Bender]

Anyone that wants to fire Burke, honestly, doesnt know anything about what has been taking place over the last 3 years, as well has no idea what pains Leaf fans have been through. Its a process, and everyone knows that. It hurts not making the playoffs, but we are still building, and have most of the right pieces in place, especially compared to where we were.

This firing Burke business sounds more like media type people trying to infultrate every aspect of Leafs coverage to try and ruin his name, what he's done and what he is continually bringing to the table. This, IMO, is sad.

I really have given up on this yr. and hope to see what becomes of this team next yr, I think the leafs are headed in the right direction.

I still believe all we need is 1 more player on the top line.

Till next season!

This simply isn't true.  There are replacement level players all over the team, from the goalie, through the captain, through each centerman, right on out.  He has built a small, weak, underskilled team that quite evidently has little idea what it wants to be, and he has paid far too much to do it.  There isn't even the hint of a truly competitive core in the Leafs' line-up, which, after three years, means that Burke's tenure has been a profound and utter failure.

I don't know how you don't find Kessel, Lupul and Grabbo competitive.

Look, anybody who thought this team was anything other than a bubble team needs to get their head checked. I don't know why all of a sudden people are acting like Burke said "This is our contender." It's not and it never was. At the same time, my view is that all the variables were right for the team to fail: Goaltending, limited goal scoring, Kooly falling off a cliff, TC not working out, bad first half PK, Lombardi not doing much, Franson being in and out.

Coming into this season I didn't think that all of those variables could happen, and judging from most people here, they didn't either. It's only in hindsight now that people are saying these things because this is what's transpired. If Kulemin didn't drop from the face of the earth, and our goaltending and PK held steady then we wouldn't be talking about this, and I don't think that those were unreasonable things to hope for: James came in and played lights out until he got clocked in the head - which nobody saw coming, and personally I'm shocked at how bad Kooly is this year. We all thought that Bozak was probably going to be on the fourth line with TC - Grabbo - Lombardi down the middle and that's obviously not how things worked out.

I don't think Burke should be fired, but I think he needs to wake up and smell the coffee: Turn over the roster like CW's said many times, take a couple of years and develop bona fide blue chip talent. Pick the long road and go with development, but pick that road NOW.

 

[Newbury]

This team is bad and they should feel bad.

All that needs to be said.