The Brian Burke Thread

[Kin]

Sure. Me too...and to be fair to Burke, he's shown he can do that when he felt it necessary too -  like when he fired Wilson.

Well, not to continue this too much but if firing Wilson is the guy's best example of quick, decisive action in the face of a problem then I'm not sure he has much of a case. I mean at that point you're basically giving him credit for not letting the Pequod sink.

 

[maplesyrup]

The more I think about it, the more I think Burke shouldn't be the face of the franchise right now. Maybe defer a lot of the media stuff to Nonis or Poulin or something- At least for the next little while. Like I've maintained, I have a lot of respect for the man but I think he makes himself an easy target. I'd like to see a good stretch where he's just for the most part, unavailable and all we get is the odd shot of him in the press box and such. I mean, most folks what him to put up or shut up. It would be interesting to see what those same folks do if he ever does put up the curtain for a while - I'm not sure they could handle that either.

 

[Erndog]

This is very offtopic, but a guy I still regret missing out on is Andrew Ladd.  I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.  I wish we dealt for Ladd at the time.  He would address soooo many issues.  He's got good size, very tough, strong, leadership, a scoring touch.  Man oh man how I wish we went Ladd instead of Versteeg 2 summers ago.  Ah well, can't cry over spilled milk.

Any chance Winnipeg trades their captain?  No eh?

 

[maplesyrup]

This is very offtopic, but a guy I still regret missing out on is Andrew Ladd.  I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.  I wish we dealt for Ladd at the time.  He would address soooo many issues.  He's got good size, very tough, strong, leadership, a scoring touch.  Man oh man how I wish we went Ladd instead of Versteeg 2 summers ago.  Ah well, can't cry over spilled milk.

Any chance Winnipeg trades their captain?  No eh?

I thought Ladd was way overrated that summer too. Man, I was wrong. Having said that, I don't see a fit here with Lupul, Mac, and Kadri trying to finally make it right now. 

 

[Kin]

Interesting choice of an example. also I don't think he was referring to former 1st rounders they have traded away.  He was talking present.

He just said first round players that they've acquired but replace Ashton there if it clears things up.  With Zee talking about top line talent I don't think lower 1st rounders really satisfies the need.

Gardiner addresses it.

I'm not 100% on board with the deification of Jake Gardiner just yet so I don't agree particularly but I'm guessing that's not something I'm going to make a lot of headway on.

 

[Erndog]

This is very offtopic, but a guy I still regret missing out on is Andrew Ladd.  I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.  I wish we dealt for Ladd at the time.  He would address soooo many issues.  He's got good size, very tough, strong, leadership, a scoring touch.  Man oh man how I wish we went Ladd instead of Versteeg 2 summers ago.  Ah well, can't cry over spilled milk.

Any chance Winnipeg trades their captain?  No eh?

I thought Ladd was way overrated that summer too. Man, I was wrong. Having said that, I don't see a fit here with Lupul, Mac, and Kadri trying to finally make it right now.

I do.  Lupul and Kessel obviously together... then Kadri/Ladd as the 2nd line wingers.  Kulemin on the 3rd line where he belongs.

Probably deal Mac (either included in the Ladd deal, or somewhere else).

The Ladd type of player is one we desparately need.  A true power forward, capable of 25 goals, provides leadership and is a warrior.  We don't have that.  We need it.  (*think Gary Roberts-ish).

 

[Kin]

I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.

There's no offense intended here but that strikes me as a really, really bizarre thing to not like about someone.

 

[Zee]

I know it sounds crazy but assuming he really believes in that, I respect him for it. Yes. Absolutely. Does it make him a good GM? Well, I don't know. I'm merely speaking on a personal level, not a professional one here.

To each their own. Personally, I've always seen an inability/unwillingness to adapt as a weakness.

Sure. Me too...and to be fair to Burke, he's shown he can do that when he felt it necessary too -  like when he fired Wilson.

The time to fire Wilson was the end of last season not this year.  Instead he rewards him with a contract extension, and then fires him.

All the while he backed Wilson he maintained he was doing a good job, playing an exciting brand of hockey, good entertainment value for the fans.

Now, after Wilson is gone, he "wasn't on the same page" with him as to how teams should play.  WHAT?  If you're not on the same page with your coach, why was he around for so long?  Burke is like a newspaper, a new story comes out every day.

 

[Erndog]

I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.

There's no offense intended here but that strikes me as a really, really bizarre thing to not like about someone.

It was just an "add on".  I really don't like Versteeg as a player.  Stick handles too much, slashes after whistles like it's nobody's business.  Is a coward.  And gives off that arrogance when really, he's a decent 2nd line type who went through 4 teams in 12 months.  The chewing of the mouthguard just bothers me.

 

[bustaheims]

He just said first round players that they've acquired but replace Ashton there if it clears things up.  With Zee talking about top line talent I don't think lower 1st rounders really satisfies the need.

What Burke actually said was that they have more 1st round picks in the organization than any other NHL team (whether or not that's true, I don't know), so, it wouldn't include Paradis, but, yes, Ashton would satisfy your point - though, in fairness to him, he wasn't a massive reach off the board type of pick like Paradis was, and was considered to be Tampa's top prospect not in the NHL at the time of the trade.

 

[maplesyrup]

This is very offtopic, but a guy I still regret missing out on is Andrew Ladd.  I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.  I wish we dealt for Ladd at the time.  He would address soooo many issues.  He's got good size, very tough, strong, leadership, a scoring touch.  Man oh man how I wish we went Ladd instead of Versteeg 2 summers ago.  Ah well, can't cry over spilled milk.

Any chance Winnipeg trades their captain?  No eh?

I thought Ladd was way overrated that summer too. Man, I was wrong. Having said that, I don't see a fit here with Lupul, Mac, and Kadri trying to finally make it right now.

I do.  Lupul and Kessel obviously together... then Kadri/Ladd as the 2nd line wingers.  Kulemin on the 3rd line where he belongs.

Probably deal Mac (either included in the Ladd deal, or somewhere else).

The Ladd type of player is one we desparately need.  A true power forward, capable of 25 goals, provides leadership and is a warrior.  We don't have that.  We need it.  (*think Gary Roberts-ish).

Hmmm... Maybe.

 

[Corn Flake]

Interesting choice of an example. also I don't think he was referring to former 1st rounders they have traded away.  He was talking present.

He just said first round players that they've acquired but replace Ashton there if it clears things up.  With Zee talking about top line talent I don't think lower 1st rounders really satisfies the need.

I think he said they had more first rounders than any other team from the last few drafts or something like that, but anyway.... I think the first rounders whether high or low all count.  They have been stockpiled high and low, some higher than others in terms of upside. 

Is the elite talent missing? Maybe it is but Gardiner IMO is close, and whoever they pick this year could be as well.  Granted the sure fire stud centre or winger to build the franchise around may not be there.. yet.. but there is a stockpile of potential in the from of 1st round drafees.

 

[Erndog]

This is very offtopic, but a guy I still regret missing out on is Andrew Ladd.  I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.  I wish we dealt for Ladd at the time.  He would address soooo many issues.  He's got good size, very tough, strong, leadership, a scoring touch.  Man oh man how I wish we went Ladd instead of Versteeg 2 summers ago.  Ah well, can't cry over spilled milk.

Any chance Winnipeg trades their captain?  No eh?

I thought Ladd was way overrated that summer too. Man, I was wrong. Having said that, I don't see a fit here with Lupul, Mac, and Kadri trying to finally make it right now.

I do.  Lupul and Kessel obviously together... then Kadri/Ladd as the 2nd line wingers.  Kulemin on the 3rd line where he belongs.

Probably deal Mac (either included in the Ladd deal, or somewhere else).

The Ladd type of player is one we desparately need.  A true power forward, capable of 25 goals, provides leadership and is a warrior.  We don't have that.  We need it.  (*think Gary Roberts-ish).

Hmmm... Maybe.

We can't go into next season with the same guys... Mac, Kule, etc, etc.  Some changes have to be made. 

Lupul-???-Kessel
Ladd-Grabbo-Kadri
Kulemin-Bozak-Frattin


Deal Mac and Franson?  Maybe Schenn?  Ladd is only 25 and signed reasonably for 4 more years I believe.  He is an IDEAL top 6 forward for us and what we need (other than that #1 center of course).

 

[Kin]

It was just an "add on".  I really don't like Versteeg as a player.  Stick handles too much, slashes after whistles like it's nobody's business.  Is a coward.  And gives off that arrogance when really, he's a decent 2nd line type who went through 4 teams in 12 months.  The chewing of the mouthguard just bothers me.

I get that everyone has their idiosyncratic likes and dislikes. I like Versteeg as a player. I just never really thought about chewing his mouthguard.

 

[maplesyrup]

This is very offtopic, but a guy I still regret missing out on is Andrew Ladd.  I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.  I wish we dealt for Ladd at the time.  He would address soooo many issues.  He's got good size, very tough, strong, leadership, a scoring touch.  Man oh man how I wish we went Ladd instead of Versteeg 2 summers ago.  Ah well, can't cry over spilled milk.

Any chance Winnipeg trades their captain?  No eh?

I thought Ladd was way overrated that summer too. Man, I was wrong. Having said that, I don't see a fit here with Lupul, Mac, and Kadri trying to finally make it right now.

I do.  Lupul and Kessel obviously together... then Kadri/Ladd as the 2nd line wingers.  Kulemin on the 3rd line where he belongs.

Probably deal Mac (either included in the Ladd deal, or somewhere else).

The Ladd type of player is one we desparately need.  A true power forward, capable of 25 goals, provides leadership and is a warrior.  We don't have that.  We need it.  (*think Gary Roberts-ish).

Hmmm... Maybe.

We can't go into next season with the same guys... Mac, Kule, etc, etc.  Some changes have to be made. 

Lupul-???-Kessel
Ladd-Grabbo-Kadri
Kulemin-Bozak-Frattin


Deal Mac and Franson?  Maybe Schenn?  Ladd is only 25 and signed reasonably for 4 more years I believe.  He is an IDEAL top 6 forward for us and what we need (other than that #1 center of course).

I never really thought about Kadri on the right side (I'm not sure why) Anyway, yeah, I like it... I'm down.

 

[Kin]

I think he said they had more first rounders than any other team from the last few drafts or something like that, but anyway.... I think the first rounders whether high or low all count.  They have been stockpiled high and low, some higher than others in terms of upside. 

Is the elite talent missing? Maybe it is but Gardiner IMO is close, and whoever they pick this year could be as well.  Granted the sure fire stud centre or winger to build the franchise around may not be there.. yet.. but there is a stockpile of potential in the from of 1st round drafees.

I disagree. I think that very shortly after a player is drafted where he was drafted becomes fairly insignificant. Adding guys who were drafted in the first round is secondary to the measured quality of those players. Being as the post of Zee's is specifically referring to that elite level talent, adding lower lights seems relatively incidental to what Zee is talking about.

Realistically you're not going to acquire elite level talent through trades and the list of elite level players who were traded young, I think, is going to be pretty small. Because of that I think there's a lot to what Zee said. They're going to have to be drafted/developed in house.

 

[Erndog]

This is very offtopic, but a guy I still regret missing out on is Andrew Ladd.  I've always severly disliked Versteeg and his chewing the mouthguard.  I wish we dealt for Ladd at the time.  He would address soooo many issues.  He's got good size, very tough, strong, leadership, a scoring touch.  Man oh man how I wish we went Ladd instead of Versteeg 2 summers ago.  Ah well, can't cry over spilled milk.

Any chance Winnipeg trades their captain?  No eh?

I thought Ladd was way overrated that summer too. Man, I was wrong. Having said that, I don't see a fit here with Lupul, Mac, and Kadri trying to finally make it right now.

I do.  Lupul and Kessel obviously together... then Kadri/Ladd as the 2nd line wingers.  Kulemin on the 3rd line where he belongs.

Probably deal Mac (either included in the Ladd deal, or somewhere else).

The Ladd type of player is one we desparately need.  A true power forward, capable of 25 goals, provides leadership and is a warrior.  We don't have that.  We need it.  (*think Gary Roberts-ish).

Hmmm... Maybe.

We can't go into next season with the same guys... Mac, Kule, etc, etc.  Some changes have to be made. 

Lupul-???-Kessel
Ladd-Grabbo-Kadri
Kulemin-Bozak-Frattin


Deal Mac and Franson?  Maybe Schenn?  Ladd is only 25 and signed reasonably for 4 more years I believe.  He is an IDEAL top 6 forward for us and what we need (other than that #1 center of course).

I never really thought about Kadri on the right side (I'm not sure why) Anyway, yeah, I like it... I'm down.

I just think with Ladd you are getting a guy who can play anywhere in the top 6.  If the Lupul/Kessel well runs dry, bang, throw Ladd with Kessel (or Lupes) and you've likely got something that works.  You got a guy who can knock people off the puck.  You've got a guy that will hit, score dirty goals, get in front of the net.  Basically, you get a guy who we have nothing like.  He's got leadership qualities and he's a good age on a good contract.  I guess that's why Winnipeg won't deal him (not to mention he is there captain).

We might have to overpay but Ladd would be totally worth it imo.  I think he's the type who's style can really elevate and make room for guys like Grabbo and Kadri.

 

[Kin]

  I guess that's why Winnipeg won't deal him (not to mention he is there captain).

Yeah, I'd guess that the price Winnipeg would want for Ladd is a price you wouldn't want to pay.

 

[maplesyrup]

I REALLY like Kane.  8)

 

[Tigger]

Why would Winnipeg trade Ladd?