Trade Deadline

[sickbeast]

What you guys don't understand about JVR is that guys like Evander Kane only got a second round draft pick. The market was soft and the other GMs were shrewd. Now before you all jump in and say that Kane is a cancer in the dressing room, let's not forget that JVR is a flawed player also. JVR is brutal defensively. So really, would you have taken a second rounder for JVR? I wouldn't.

 

[Kin]

What you guys don't understand about JVR is that guys like Evander Kane only got a second round draft pick.

I really don't know why you'd say this, and build an argument around it, when it's just not true.

 

[sickbeast]

What you guys don't understand about JVR is that guys like Evander Kane only got a second round draft pick.

I really don't know why you'd say this, and build an argument around it, when it's just not true.

What's not true about it? It's only a first round pick if San Jose signs him to an extension. The fourth round pick is conditional also. From what I understand the trade was basically Kane for a second round pick. Please correct me if I am wrong. Otherwise I don't appreciate the nit picking and the micro managing for no reason.

 

[Kin]

What's not true about it? It's only a first round pick if San Jose signs him to an extension. The fourth round pick is conditional also.

The condition on the 4th round pick is whether it's a 4th in 2019 or a 3rd in 2020, at San Jose's choice. So it's definitely two picks(and an AHL depth player/prospect) that could just as easily be said to be a conditional 1st(re-signing Kane isn't out of the question) and a 3rd. Either way, he 100% didn't get dealt for "only" a 2nd round pick.

Beyond that Kane isn't just a question mark in the dressing room, he's also a flawed player(he's not getting any Selke votes either). A flawed player who hasn't scored 50+ points since 2011-2012(the only time in his career when he has) vs. JVR who's cracked that mark in three of the last four years. So I'm pretty comfortable saying JVR is a better and more valuable player than Kane.

 

[Highlander]

At least Lou didn't make a crazydumb move, reverting to his final years in Jersey.  Although in saying that, I guess I am mostly agreeing with Nik that the current front office hasn't really pulled off a trade or signing of note since Andersen.  I was willing to let them dine out on that for this deadline, but starting this summer they need to show us they can add the pieces needed to make the team a top-tier contender.  Then we'll see how shrewd they really are.

How many rounds in the playoffs do they have to get through to show we are a top-tier contender?

 

[Guilt Trip]

At least Lou didn't make a crazydumb move, reverting to his final years in Jersey.  Although in saying that, I guess I am mostly agreeing with Nik that the current front office hasn't really pulled off a trade or signing of note since Andersen.  I was willing to let them dine out on that for this deadline, but starting this summer they need to show us they can add the pieces needed to make the team a top-tier contender.  Then we'll see how shrewd they really are.

How many rounds in the playoffs do they have to get through to show we are a top-tier contender?

None..They're likely going up against one of the top 5 teams in the league. That's a tough road. Winning a round or losing one will have little impact..The Leafs are a very good team.

 

[Highlander]

At least Lou didn't make a crazydumb move, reverting to his final years in Jersey.  Although in saying that, I guess I am mostly agreeing with Nik that the current front office hasn't really pulled off a trade or signing of note since Andersen.  I was willing to let them dine out on that for this deadline, but starting this summer they need to show us they can add the pieces needed to make the team a top-tier contender.  Then we'll see how shrewd they really are.

How many rounds in the playoffs do they have to get through to show we are a top-tier contender?

None..They're likely going up against one of the top 5 teams in the league. That's a tough road. Winning a round or losing one will have little impact..The Leafs are a very good team.

That is not my point, ZBBM said we need to add pieces during the summer and I don't have a problem with that, but if we end up contending for the Cup, then why do we need to add expensive pieces that may not fit in. I think these guys know what they are doing, since Shanahan took over. If we get thrashed in the first round then we have to look at things.

 

[ZBBM]

What I'm saying is that this year should be the last of the low-expectation years, in terms of the playoffs.  Next year is the beginning of what I would consider a real window of time that they should be going for it.  It remains to be seen whether Lou/Shanahan can get the defenseman (men) we need.

 

[skrackle]

At least Lou didn't make a crazydumb move, reverting to his final years in Jersey.  Although in saying that, I guess I am mostly agreeing with Nik that the current front office hasn't really pulled off a trade or signing of note since Andersen.  I was willing to let them dine out on that for this deadline, but starting this summer they need to show us they can add the pieces needed to make the team a top-tier contender.  Then we'll see how shrewd they really are.

How many rounds in the playoffs do they have to get through to show we are a top-tier contender?

None..They're likely going up against one of the top 5 teams in the league. That's a tough road. Winning a round or losing one will have little impact..The Leafs are a very good team.

I'd say the Leafs would have to make the final 4 to be considered a contender. The Leafs are an improving team, but they have not won a playoff round since the Pat Quinn era. That's not on current management, but just being happy to be in the playoffs will wear thin soon.

They are obviously banking on improvement mostly from within. Winning at least one round would be an indication the Leafs are on the right track.

 

[hockeyfan1]

I saw it as a two-step process:

1. Sell some UFAs for futures (picks and/or prospects.)
2. Buy some quality talent.

With step one, I would have been glad to move even one of the upcoming UFAs. JvR would obviously net the best return, but even Bozak should have gotten a 2nd rounder and a mid-level prospect.

Step two didn't even have to happen for me to be satisfied. But it would have been a bonus, particularly if they moved two or more of the UFAs.

I'm bummed out neither happened. And, honestly, I'm bummed that we didn't get McDonagh, even though I knew chances weren't great. He's the exact type of player I think the team needs. I don't think this team really needs a Karlsson or Doughty calibre player, but he would have been a huge upgrade.

Acquiring McDonagh probably would have helped the Leafs, but according to how Lamoniello and the management were thinking, and to some extent Babcock included, the price for acquiring him might just have been too high -- a 1st Round pick, a prospect and perhaps either one of Dermott or Lillejgren.

Mirltle's piece explains and quotes Lou Lam & Babcock's comments (from the radio show).

[tweet]968358710086193157[/tweet]

 

[herman]

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/31-thoughts-karlsson-pacioretty-deadline-deals-fell-flat/
Re: who else was in on Karlsson other than the Golden Knights:

3. [...] A couple of sources indicated Toronto was looking to add another first-round pick, and it would have been interesting to see what the Maple Leafs were going to do with that.

Looks like they were considering flipping a UFA (I assume JvR, because who else would net a 1st?) to generate some trade capital, but held off when the back half of the trade did not materialize.

 

[herman]

RDS: Valiev and Rychel follow-up

Valiev on whether or not he was surprised to be traded.

Not at all. I wanted that to happen. In fact, I asked

 

[CarltonTheBear]

RDS: Valiev and Rychel follow-up

Valiev on whether or not he was surprised to be traded.

Not at all. I wanted that to happen. In fact, I asked

Please trade me to the team with the worst minor-league defence depth you can find.

 

[TML fan]

That's not surprising. His chances to crack this lineup were pretty slim.

 

[Highlander]

Thanks for this report. I wish them both the best, especially Valiev

 

[herman]

Lou considered the promotions of Kapanen and Dermott to be like trade acquisitions. Which to me, also reads as they've played their way out of the general trade bait tier.

https://www.mapleleafshotstove.com/2018/03/01/lou-lamoriello-relatively-quiet-trade-deadline-couple-additions-last-several-weeks-like-trades-kasperi-kapanen-travis-dermott/

Re: making the big trade at the deadline:

Lamoriello: It all depends on the individual situation and what the needs are for that team. I believe in the team that you have, at this given time, you ought to know if they are good enough to go a certain distance and what the need is. We tried very hard here over the last couple of years to stay focused on a plan, to have a team and have an organization that can sustain competing for a number of years ? not just one shot at it. We had a couple of additions, too, in the last several weeks that are like trades in Kapanen and Dermott. There are little things that happen that persuade you to go one way or another in how you make decisions.

Re: Lou's build philosophy

Can you put together a team now in 2018 the same way the New Jersey Devils were put together? Is it still the same formula if you want to get a team that can win the Stanley Cup and contend and win it for many years?

Lamoriello: I think it goes back to the drafting. There is credit that should be given to the scouts in our organization for the players that were drafted, in particular players that were drafted in the high-end. Of course, Auston was drafted first overall, but when you look at the decisions they made ? and this was prior to me ? on Mitch Marner ? there were other players available ? and the decision on Willy Nylander ? there were others that were available ? and where they turned out? Look at Connor Brown and Dermott, and the acquisition they made for Hyman. I?m only looking at the young players right now that will serve the core for future because they stay within that window of free agency with the age factor.

I believe you can, to answer the question? trying to give it a little background. They have to be supported with the players to have success. You certainly have to start with the goaltender. I always believe that you start with the goaltender and go through the defense and then, if you can get the quality forwards, you have a chance.

 

[Kin]

"If you think about it, these college free agents are like having 1st round picks".

 

[Zee]

I mean, I kind of agree with the philosophy in general.  The Leafs now with Dermott and Kapanen having regular roles are improved from the team that played back in October, so in that sense they're like "acquisitions" since they weren't on the Leafs until recently.  Hopefully Plekanec can provide a bit of an upgrade down the middle and we'll see where this thing goes in the playoffs.

 

[Kin]

We've had GMs try to upsell their inactivity before. It's a stretch to call that a philosophy.

 

[Zee]

We've had GMs try to upsell their inactivity before. It's a stretch to call that a philosophy.

Well it's a matter of a minor upgrade with Plekanec, and seeing what we have in house.  I don't mind the approach of playing our guys down the stretch and into the playoffs to see how good they are, we're still only 2 years removed from 30th overall.