Armchair GM 2018-2019

[Kin]

Did you just describe Peter Zezel?

No? Zezel was a premier defensive Centre who never played with particularly good offensive linemates. Brown's an ok two-way winger who doesn't really excel in either end.

Brown's ok and everything but he's pretty replaceable.

 

[Foreign Corresppondent]

Did you just describe Peter Zezel?

No? Zezel was a premier defensive Centre who never played with particularly good offensive linemates. Brown's an ok two-way winger who doesn't really excel in either end.

Brown's ok and everything but he's pretty replaceable.

I hate to sound like a dick, but i compared the old world to the brave new one, so it's on me if that's how it's seen. How do you replace Brown outside an ELC?

 

[Kin]

I hate to sound like a dick, but i compared the old world to the brave new one, so it's on me if that's how it's seen. How do you replace Brown outside an ELC?

You sign or trade for someone? I'm not entirely sure what you're asking. Guys of Brown's ability are usually available at a reasonable cost.

 

[Kin]

That seems like a terrible deal for us. Could Nylander and change for Trouba happen, because i'd eat that deal on toast. Ehlers' contract is the part that shakes me, and i'm firmly on Team Jake. With Rielly being who he is, Jake's role has never been more clear. And whie Nylander for Trouba might make some recall how Taylor Hall wound up in Jersey, it's not the same thing. Nylander is not a franchise player, and Trouba is 100% a top pairing guy.

The Leafs probably can't sign Gardiner long-term regardless and Trouba for Nylander makes no sense for Winnipeg. Especially not when Winnipeg is in as bad a position as anyone to give Nylander the sort of extension he wants with their own negotiations with Laine coming up.

The reason the Hall trade happened, and Hall didn't really scream "franchise player" when he was traded either, is because there aren't many teams out there with such a surplus of good young defensemen that they're willing to go 1:1 where the talent is roughly even.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

I hate to sound like a dick, but i compared the old world to the brave new one, so it's on me if that's how it's seen. How do you replace Brown outside an ELC?

I like Brown a lot. But depth wingers are the easiest roster position to replace - ie Tyler Ennis. That said, I'm not sure I'd consider Brown as a salary dump, rather a throw in to a deal if the other team valued him enough to make it happen.

 

[Kin]

I hate to sound like a dick, but i compared the old world to the brave new one, so it's on me if that's how it's seen. How do you replace Brown outside an ELC?

I like Brown a lot. But depth wingers are the easiest roster position to replace - ie Tyler Ennis. That said, I'm not sure I'd consider Brown as a salary dump, rather a throw in to a deal if the other team valued him enough to make it happen.

Beyond that, and this applies just as much to the comments re: Gardiner, I think we're going to have to get used to the idea that "getting rid of" someone doesn't mean thinking they're a bad player. It's just a cap reality that if the Leafs are going to be a top-heavy team, and with Tavares, Marner and Matthews they will be no matter what happens with Nylander, then the Leafs are going to have to have cheaper options lower down the line-up.

Brown is ok value at 2.1 but in a year or two he'll probably want a raise and even at 2.5 or 2.75 it's pretty questionable when, like you say, the Leafs will have options.

 

[princedpw]

The reason the Hall trade happened, and Hall didn't really scream "franchise player" when he was traded either, ...

A minor aside that's neither here nor there when it comes to this thread:  Good oilers bloggers actually were screaming "franchise player" when he was traded (and before that).  They pointed to his possession stats which were so far above everyone else on the team it was crazy.  They observed that no matter who you played him with he dragged their shot metrics up to amazing.

(I'm just saying that many knowledgeable people panned it instantaneously as being the horrendously bad trade that it has turned out to be.)

 

[Guilt Trip]

The reason the Hall trade happened, and Hall didn't really scream "franchise player" when he was traded either, ...

A minor aside that's neither here nor there when it comes to this thread:  Good oilers bloggers actually were screaming "franchise player" when he was traded (and before that).  They pointed to his possession stats which were so far above everyone else on the team it was crazy.  They observed that no matter who you played him with he dragged their shot metrics up to amazing.

(I'm just saying that many knowledgeable people panned it instantaneously as being the horrendously bad trade that it has turned out to be.)

Anybody with a brain knew it was a bad deal right from the start. McDavid was the franchise player but Hall was definitely #2. That's like the Leafs trading Tavares for a#3 or #4 D man, seeing he's our #2 centre.

 

[Kin]

A minor aside that's neither here nor there when it comes to this thread:  Good oilers bloggers actually were screaming "franchise player" when he was traded (and before that).  They pointed to his possession stats which were so far above everyone else on the team it was crazy.  They observed that no matter who you played him with he dragged their shot metrics up to amazing.

(I'm just saying that many knowledgeable people panned it instantaneously as being the horrendously bad trade that it has turned out to be.)

I think everyone knew that value wise it wasn't a very good trade as soon as it was made. Even if Hall was "just" a very good 1st line winger then Larsson was still a lousy return for him.

That said I'm not sure I'd agree his pre-trade possession numbers say "superstar" either. They certainly say best player of a bad bunch but by the time he was traded the team already had McDavid and Draisaitl and Hall's numbers in that regard are no longer wildly outpacing the other good players on the team.

Regardless, we all agree that it wasn't a good trade which is why I'm making the case that  the Leafs, you know, shouldn't try to repeat it by trading their very good young forward for just the best defenseman the market will provide.

 

[Foreign Corresppondent]

I hate to sound like a dick, but i compared the old world to the brave new one, so it's on me if that's how it's seen. How do you replace Brown outside an ELC?

You sign or trade for someone? I'm not entirely sure what you're asking. Guys of Brown's ability are usually available at a reasonable cost.

Is his cost unreasonable? I'm curious what the benefit of shipping like for like is.

 

[Kin]

Is his cost unreasonable? I'm curious what the benefit of shipping like for like is.

In a vacuum it's not unreasonable. But in a couple years when he may want a raise you really have to question if it's the best use of money for a guy who's their #3 RW or so even with Nylander out of the lineup. Especially when they have good prospect depth at the position.

 

[cabber24]

I am hoping the Nylander contract dispute and the Matthews injury has determined that Kappi and Johnsson are not 4th liners.

My guess at Babcock's lines:

HYMAN-TAVARES-MARNER
MARLEAU-MATTHEWS-NYLANDER
JOHNSSON-KADRI-KAPANEN
ENNIS-GAUTHIER-BROWN

My Lines:

HYMAN-TAVARES-MARNER
JOHNSSON-MATTHEWS-NYLANDER
MARLEAU-KADRI-KAPANEN
ENNIS-LINDHOLM-BROWN

 

[Phileas Fogg]

My Lines:
HYMAN-TAVARES-MARNER
JOHNSSON-MATTHEWS-NYLANDER
MARLEAU-KADRI-KAPANEN
ENNIS-LINDHOLM-BROWN

Yeah, I like your lines. I'd only want to potentially switch Kapenen and Johnsson, but it's an embarrassment of riches regardless.

Damn, that's a scary top 3 lines if you're the opposing team looking to linematch.

 

[Bullfrog]

My guess is your lines are the one's Babcock uses. I'm 100% sure Lindholm is in over Gauthier. maybe Babcock switches Johnsson and Marleau.

 

[Zee]

My guess is your lines are the one's Babcock uses. I'm 100% sure Lindholm is in over Gauthier. maybe Babcock switches Johnsson and Marleau.

Babcock has already played Lindholm over Gauthier why would he suddenly go back to the goat?

 

[Redleaf]

I?d love to see this as our first line ..

KAPANEN-MATTHEWS-NYLANDER

 

[Redleaf]

My guess is your lines are the one's Babcock uses. I'm 100% sure Lindholm is in over Gauthier. maybe Babcock switches Johnsson and Marleau.

Babcock has already played Lindholm over Gauthier why would he suddenly go back to the goat?

He plays the Gautier when facing more physical teams .

The goat will be playing Saturday night. I?d bet on that.

 

[CarltonTheBear]

He plays the Gautier when facing more physical teams .

The goat will be playing Saturday night. I?d bet on that.

I really don't think we've seen Babcock do this at any point this season. Lindholm has played in every single game. Gauthier's only been inserted into the line-up when there's an injury.

 

[Phileas Fogg]

Not to mention I don't think I've seen a game where Gauthier has used his size in a situation involving any sort of physicality. He's like a gentle giant out there, with stone hands to boot. I think I've seen enough.

 

[Zee]

Not to mention I don't think I've seen a game where Gauthier has used his size in a situation involving any sort of physicality. He's like a gentle giant out there, with stone hands to boot. I think I've seen enough.

You won't see him again once Nylander is in. (barring injury knock on wood, pray, do whatever you have to)